Boston was thrown into a tizzy when an attempt by Cartoon Network to promote its upcoming "Aqua Teen Hunger Force" feature film backfired into a perceived terrorist plot.
Apparently little electronic blinky devices based upon the ATHF character "Mooninite" have been showing up in major cities all across the country. But only in Beantown did citizens suddenly start worrying that these promotional devices were, in fact, part of an insidious terrorist scheme. As a consequence, the bomb squad has been spending its time running around the city defusing harmless toys, and now police have arrested the poor hapless bastard who was hired to put the things up around the city.
The reason it's of particular interest to this blog is that New England Comics (which, by the way, I'm told is having a 50% off sale that ends today) was one of the sites to receive one of the devices, and hilarity ensued. My daughter, Gwen, a store employee, was interviewed by local TV news. Click on the site link below and go to the section "Comic Book Store Employees Discuss Hoax."
http://www.thebostonchannel.com/video/index.html
PAD
Posted by Peter David at February 1, 2007 09:29 AM | TrackBack | Other blogs commentingHehe, she spoke well, and I was impressed with her manager too. I was wondering how long it would take for someone to suggest that there might be some degree of paranoia at work...
Some?
If the adds had had Ronald McDonald on them, or the King, people wouldn't have freaked out at all.
What surprises me is that something that clearly took some time and money to put together hadn't taken the steps to, oh, I don't know, get permission to put these things up everywhere. I know ad people love secrecy and surprises, but there's also prudence and not tresspassing on others' property to be concerned with.
On one hand, it's kind of funny, but on the other, you can't be too careful. If the city wasn't aware that strange objects were going to be installed under bridges, then they were right in checking it out.
I don't know. The King always freaks me out. Especially those commmercials where the guy wakes up with the King in his bed or peering into his window. Is he a king or a stalker?
I'm totally freaked out by the King. But he apparantly is a wicked defensive player in the NFL...and polite, to boot.
"Is he a king or a stalker?"
One of those XBox games they made is called Sneak King, where the King sneaks around handing people food (sounds like an oxymoron).
Anyways, I'd already said what I think of this ad campaign, but to summarize: really bad ad campaign idea, but completely made successful (well, unless you were arrested) thanks to the BPD.
I'd completely forgotten about the ATHF movie, and there will be a lot more people wanting to see it to find out what all the fuss is about now.
Your daughter is very composed and presents her story very well, Peter. I take it that the guerilla marketing team (such as it was) did not get "permission" to install these things, or people wouldn't have been in a panic about them. The owner of the comics shop did not seem to be aware that it was going to be installed, you'll note. Then again, he wasn't all freaked out about it. It was flat and had a square - with hands- flipping the bird. How dangerous do you think that could actually be?
Posted by: Kathy Pearlman at February 1, 2007 11:46 AM
How dangerous do you think that could actually be?
Colleen Doran, creator, writer, and illustrator of "A Distant Soil," has offered her own unique perspective at her blog (www.adistantsoil.com/blog). She is the daughter of a police officer, and she says toys have been used to lure people to bombs before. So the people who reported the "Mooninite" devices weren't necessarily overreacting.
Of course this newsflash keeps popping up in various forums that I frequent, and I keep writing the same response. My job occasionally requires me to leave sensors in public places for days at a time to perform environmental monitoring. Even *before* 9/11, my colleagues and I learned that if you place a random electrical device in a public place without either informing the authorities or leaving a identification on the device with a reliable contact number, there is a 100% chance that the bomb squad would get called, and a 95% chance that your $5000 device would get blown up.
The arrests last night were over the top, but the BPD's response yesterday seemed right on. They closed some roads, they investigated, they found the truth, and they reopened the roads. Aside from the traffic tie-ups, life went on in Boston. Isn't that the way it should have gone?
Ahem...
...ehrm...Peter, I mean, Mr.David...
...How old exactly your daughter is?
*wink wink nudge nudge*
Just joking. Agree on the comment on her beign articulate and very "at ease" in front of the camera. Also agree you cant be cautious enough, but terrorists want to cause...terror. Avoiding public alarm unless necesary is a cornerstone of a sensible anti-terrorism policy.
In a time of crisis like this, I think the only thing to say is...
Mooninites... unite!
Ahem. Anyway, I think what we're missing in the whole discussion of whether this could be perceived as something dangerous is... is this the way we want to live? Always looking at things suspiciously? In fear and constant worry? At a certain point, I think you have to say, "If I'm gonna get blown up, I'm get blown up, there's no way I can stop every possible threat" and simply focus on the major stuff.
Colleen Doran, creator, writer, and illustrator of "A Distant Soil," has offered her own unique perspective at her blog (www.adistantsoil.com/blog). She is the daughter of a police officer, and she says toys have been used to lure people to bombs before. So the people who reported the "Mooninite" devices weren't necessarily overreacting.
And potential terrorists wouldn't think to recycle this?
Hm. Or they could do it with Scooby Doo?
Food for thought, here....
roger tang, I'm not quite sure what you're getting at. If it's just me being dense, I apologize. But the only point I was making is that people have used toys to disguise bombs before, so it's not unreasonable for people to be concerned when they see a strange device in an odd place.
Peter David, your daughter is intelligent, articulate, confident, and lovely. Plus, she works in a comic-book store and her father is Peter David. That young lady has it ALL. ;)
Here's the thing about this that gets me. These things were pretty slick looking. Professionally made, so it would appear. How many terrorists do we know have a history of producing such devices?
There's a reason why the terrorist uses the suicide bomber to deliver their weapons: It's a hidden bomb. It's not out in the open, it doesn't look suspicious, and it can move around and find the most crowded place to go off. What good does it do a terrorist to place an explosive device out in the open with neon lights on it? This isn't how we're going to be hit. When that happens, it'll be just like it is all over the world. Someone innocuous looking will walk into a crowded area with a bomb attached to their chest, maybe shout something in a language no one around him understands, and detonate the explosives. There won't be any neon, or anything overt about him. Because if there were, he'd likely get caught.
Was the ad stunt stupid? Only from the perspective that it was done without notification or approval of property owners. Was Boston's reaction even more stupid? Yes. Rather than calling out the entire bomb squad and shutting down half the city, couldn't they have rather quickly found one of these devices and determined that it wasn't a bomb? Then just tracked them back to Time Warner and ordered their removal, along with notice that a hefty fine would be forthcoming.
"is this the way we want to live? Always looking at things suspiciously? In fear and constant worry?"
It's not like that. If you see a suspicious object you call the police and keep your distance. If the police is experienced they might realize it's nothing with a glance, or if they'll not sure the bomb squad will close the nearby area for 10 minutes and take care of it. 99% of the time it's nothing, so its more a hassle than anything, a routine you go threw every once in a while. Certainly not a life of fear.
And Boston's "finest" continue to go completely over the top.
At the arraignment of the two men arrested:
"It's clear the intent was to get attention by causing fear and unrest that there was a bomb in that location," Assistant Attorney General John Grossman said at their arraignment.
I'm already seeing comments from other people in MA wondering why the city is so full of dumbasses.
"There's a reason why the terrorist uses the suicide bomber to deliver their weapons: It's a hidden bomb. It's not out in the open, it doesn't look suspicious, and it can move around and find the most crowded place to go off. What good does it do a terrorist to place an explosive device out in the open with neon lights on it? This isn't how we're going to be hit. When that happens, it'll be just like it is all over the world. Someone innocuous looking will walk into a crowded area with a bomb attached to their chest, maybe shout something in a language no one around him understands, and detonate the explosives. There won't be any neon, or anything overt about him. Because if there were, he'd likely get caught."
Before there were suicide bombers terrorists used to leave bombs, i.e. suspicious objects. People adapted by paying more attention. Later you had bombs in cars. Suicide bombings was the next step, and only with Islamic or Tamili terrorists. Suspicious objects is so 80s. Now you have to keep an eye for suspicious looking people (wearing coats in the summer, nervousness), and open your bag when you visit certain places. Eventually that too will get out of terrorist fashion maybe.
roger tang, I'm not quite sure what you're getting at. If it's just me being dense, I apologize. But the only point I was making is that people have used toys to disguise bombs before, so it's not unreasonable for people to be concerned when they see a strange device in an odd place.
That was the exact point I was trying to make. ANd given that we had a false alarm on this, why wouldn't a terrrorist (foreign or domestic) re-use this idea for their purposes.
Your daughter was great Peter! Hadn't heard a local perspective about the commotion until that story.
Manager made some good points as well.
-Chris
Bobb, what would be truly stupid would be for citizens and/or the authorities to look at such a device and then say, "Oh, this is too well made, it can't be anything dangerous because that's not how terrorists operate."
First, that's an unprovable assumption. Just because terrorists always have operated in a certain fashion doesn't mean they always will. Second, terrorists aren't our only worry. Remember Columbine? Those were enraged, out-of-control students who committed that horror, not a terrorist cell. The idea that some small group of nuts might plant bombs in toys just because they could is not so far-fetched.
Asst. Attorney General Grossman is clearly mis-reading the intent of this stunt. And I certainly believe that the lack of intent to harm should mitigate any charges filed against those tied with this stunt. Nevertheless, I believe those connected with the "promotion" should face some sort of consequences.
Posted by: roger tang at February 1, 2007 01:50 PM
That was the exact point I was trying to make. ANd given that we had a false alarm on this, why wouldn't a terrrorist (foreign or domestic) re-use this idea for their purposes.
In other words, I'm dense but you're just too nice to say so. ;)
I dunno...I was living with terrorist threats and bomb scares and like in the 80s. To this day, I see a backpack or something sitting around unattended and I'm looking for an exit in the other direction. Even if it is an "old and busted" method of attack these days. Get told how much of a target you are most every day for a few years and the old habits are hard to break. I don't really fault Boston for how they handled it, but I'm curious what happened in these other cities that apparently didn't pay much attention?
I was working the Olympics in Atlanta on the tech side of things. There was a place that a bunch of us use to meet up during the concerts when we were not on call. It was at the base of a lighting tower (see where this is going?) The night that the bomb went off I passed on meeting up with the gang in favor of finishing up something I was writing at the time. The rest of the gang had been on the same gig so they were not there either. We count ourselves very lucky and none of us mind opening up our bags for security checks to this day.
I put something about this up on my blog this morning:
http://www.cwob.com/yellowtext/yellowtext0207.html#70118
An electronic device crudely stuck up on a bridge support with wires leading to a taped-up something that would make just about anyone who's ever been to the movies think "explosives." Nobody knows what it is or how it got there. The results were pretty obvious. By all reports, the police reacted in a proper "it's almost certainly nothing, but let's not take a chance" manner.
As a Bostonian: it didn't shut down the city, it didn't throw the population into a panic, and as of the midday newscast, the two people who put them up have been released on a rather nominal bail and even the Mayor is saying that they're guilty of nothing more than trying to make a few bucks.
There are morons involved in this story, but all of them work at the Cartoon Network and the ad agency they hired to promote the show.
It's bad enough that we're all forced to look at ads everywhere on billboards and sidewalks. When corporations think "Hey, there's a spot of empty space where people are apt to look...let's slap an ad right there in the middle of the night without getting anybody's permission" that's a pretty bad turn of events.
That's not "guerrilla marketing." That's known as "acting like a bunch of *******s."
I know in Chicago at least one of the adds was confiscated by police. That's the first I heard that any were in Chicago.
The thing is, are we going to let those that want to kill us force us to jump at every shadow, or are we going to go about our lives with the knowledge that risks exist, we need to take care, but let's not get crazy and overreact.
I'm one of the most paranoid people I know. Ask my wife. She'll tell you I come up with some of the most crazy ideas sometimes. But we're not talking about an old duffel bag left in the middle of a train station floor, or a large box lying around somewhere. These were neon light devices left in places that were not terribly crowded. Granted, a nail/shrapnel device doesn't need a dense crown, and in fact probably is more effective in a more wide-spread, moderatly crowded area, but had these actually been bombs, they were very poorly placed.
I suppose I shouldn't excuse the chance of the terrorist being less intelligent than I'm giving them credit for. And there's blame to be shared all around. If it's a criminal offense in Boston to hang advertising without a permit or permission of the property owner, or on public property (like the bridges) then sure, go after whoever's responsible for that. And if the ad department has memos lying around saying "let's hang them around town like bombs. It'll be a blast. Get it?" Then by all means, go after them for reckless endagerment.
And in the meantime, have the police review their emergency response protocols for responding to a potential bomb threat. The claims that Boston wants Time Warner to pay for the OT used for the response is ludicrous.
This isn't a case of the ad company hiring someone to go into a dark theatre and shout "there's a FIRE in the lobby" (panic ensues as patrons rush for the exits, missing the final part of the ad "and it's all about Cartoon Network's new Movie..." I don't think a reasonable person would assume that a neon light device hung under a bridge was a bomb. If you wanted to blow up a bridge, you'd disguise it to look like it belonged there, not put bright lights on it to call attention to it.
This even made it onto BBC news over here in England. A glowing sign with a little square man flipping the bird confused with a bomb, the amusement. Also, i've now found the site of the most wonderful Peter David, i'm a big x-factor fan, how things fall into place hehe. Whenever I see an episode with the mooninites in they crack me up, now they will do all the more so.
I don't think a reasonable person would assume that a neon light device hung under a bridge was a bomb. If you wanted to blow up a bridge, you'd disguise it to look like it belonged there, not put bright lights on it to call attention to it.
Well, a week ago, sure.
Now? I dunno...Now would be a perfect time to absolutely mimic a Mooninite ad.
Shouldn't panic, but let's not be complacent...
Posted by: Bobb Alfred at February 1, 2007 02:34 PM
I don't think a reasonable person would assume that a neon light device hung under a bridge was a bomb.
A reasonable person should not assume that a strange-looking device placed in an odd spot is a bomb. A reasonable person, however, should also not assume that a strange-looking device placed in an odd spot is not a bomb. They should assume nothing and probably call the authorities.
Posted by: Bobb Alfred at February 1, 2007 02:34 PM
If you wanted to blow up a bridge, you'd disguise it to look like it belonged there, not put bright lights on it to call attention to it.
That depends. If you're a nutcase who wants someone to pick up a device so they'll be hurt, then, yeah, you'd want to draw attention to it.
Bobb, you're a lawyer. Let's say these little devices were in some way harmful, but the authorities didn't take them seriously for exactly the reasons you've laid out. Do you mean to tell me the city's not gonna get sued??? C'mon!
If the authorities overreacted (and I don't believe they did), well, I'd rather they err on the side of caution. Look, it's not like the city reacted by enacting martial law and imposing a 9 p.m. curfew indefinitely. They sent the appropriate responders to check out suspicious devices, and once the devices were determined to be harmless the city went back to normal.
Frankly, in situations like this, the authorities don't have the luxury of over-thinking this in the way that you're advocating they do. They get a call, they investigate, they take appropriate precautions.
I'd be curious to know why the other cities where these devices were planted reacted in a more low-key fashion. Have any of the articles about this incident addressed that?
This is one with the recent stupid "morning zoo" stunt where contestants were urged to drink enormous quantities of water. One woman died.
In their need to get attention for their product that the product wouldn't normally deserve, and their general incompetence in the world at large, advertising people do stupid things. And there is always the chance of them doing something fatal.
I put it to you who pooh-pooh this little item. What if someone got wind of this...and grabbed some of the devices and made them real bombs? It's entirely possible. And (if you ever saw "Platoon") you know how cute toys were set up as the triggers for booby traps.
The only thing I can think of, in the realm of animation, that was similar was an ad put together for the Icebox.com show "Mr. Wong." Phony ads for a Chinese restaurant were placed all through Chinatown in San Francisco, and when you called the number the racist cartoon character Mr. Wong insulted you. That worked out so well that icebox.com went out of business soon afterwards.
Have any of the articles about this incident addressed that?
Some have mentioned NYC finding out about Boston, contacting Cartoon Network, and then CN telling them the locations so they could be removed. No uproar.
Otherwise, I've only seen Seattle mentioned once. Again, ads removed, no uproar.
But, as for the city returning to normal? Well, the city has, but the mayor and district attorney are both certifiable.
I mean, the "clear intent" that those ads were to cause fear? I'd hate to think what will happen if Boston ever faced a real terrorist threat; martial law might not be out of the question.
Gwen came off great--not to go all Joe Biden on her but it's great to see a young person who is so articulate and doesn't punctuate every other word with "um", "Y'know", "dude" or "bababooey".
A smart, attractive, articulate female who works in a comic book store...she must have enough stories to write a good book by now.
Since I was just sent home from school two days ago by a bomb threat (complete with phoney bomb) I have a level of sympathy for the police but the statement by the assistant Attorney General seems crazy. Why on earth would they have wanted to start a panic? How does associating "bomb" with "upcoming movie" sound like a wise promotional idea?
Anyone else flashback to the Simpsons episode with the buried "angel skeleton" that turned out to be a stunt to advertize the new mall? Once again, The Simpsons did it first.
Bill, I've not suggested that people just ignore them. Call the authorities if you think something's suspicious, by all means. It just seems like the authorties' first response was to call out the bomb squad. They couldn't just look at one of them and see that it was a sign?
The thing is, if this is a normal and accepted reaction, how do we trust anything? How can you trust that the "Open" sign you just had delivered wasn't actually constructed by some terrorist, and will one day explode during your 10th anneversary sale? There are any number of things around us that could be used to hide a bomb...mailboxes, vans, garbage cans. We can't vouch for every single one of these things. Why stop with these adds? Let's take the effor to go through every single mechanical device installed or repaired over the past 6 years to make sure it's not a bomb. Or force every bulky-looking man to disrobe so we can be certain he's really just fat, and not wearing a bomb.
Like I said, I'm very paranoid. The key is I KNOW I'm paranoid, and I don't let it control me. I try not to let it influence me too much. Boston's reaction is that of a paranoid out of control.
Posted by: Bill Mulligan at February 1, 2007 02:54 PM
Since I was just sent home from school two days ago by a bomb threat (complete with phoney bomb)...
How many times do I have to tell you I had NOTHING to do with that?????
Ted Turner vs. Boston: Bring it ON.
I always hated the Red Sox.
Um, Peter?
Where's the exclamation point?
I was watching the news clip with Gwen, and wondered, has she abandoned the exclamation point at the end of her name as a relic of her childhood, decline to include it when speaking into the microphone to avoid confusion in the viewing public? Or did the graphics editors simply go, "Um..................uh-uh. I'm not putting that in there."?
Just curious. :-)
You want paranoid--how about when you go to Sams Club and people offer you food .and you go and eat it! I don't know about the rest of you but it could be Osama Bin Laden, complete with turban and scary curved dagger but if he's got a plate of mini hotdogs wrapped in crescent roll dough I'm popping those baby's like ecstasy, while Osama smiles and says "Enjoy, my infidel friend!".
If the terrorists ever catch on they could poison thousands.
Anyway, if you want to see the two guys arrested, acting like jackasses, go to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zx2ytr2Oyv4. It's funny though their lawyer probably wants to open his wrists. They refuse to talk about anything but hair. For their sakes I hope they tone it down a bit in front of the judge--only on Boston Legal can you get away with funny stuff in court.
Another video is at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iv9s_fz0K2I showing them putting the signs up. Don't specifically see them at Gwen's place (which is what they ought to re-name New England Comics).
Hey, how much do you suppose one of those signs would bring on ebay?
New York Coty, where terrorists actually struck had these marketing tools too, but their mayor and police are a bunch of retarded morons, so notice no "panic" or stupid charges filed there....
Go dunk yourselves in Boston Harbor leaders and people of Boston....
In Boston we can clearly see the terrorists have won... luckily it hasn't spread to the rest of the country... (at least not yet)
And as far as the radio stunt "Hold your wee for a Wii" fiasco... Natural Selection at work. Listeners of the show even called in to bring up the risks, and still the woman never bothered to look into the risks... Darwin worked right this time...
Bill Mulligan, my brain's been going a hundred miles an hour at work. On further thought, you getting sent home due to a bomb threat ain't occasion for joking. It's damn scary.
I'm guessing the perp is a little turd -- er, teenager. Did they catch whoever it was?
And how the crap do you get any teaching done in an environment where the basic rules of civility have been eroded away to almost nothing???
Glad you're safe, by the way, my friend.
(HELLO. YOUR HOST HERE. I AM DELETING THE TEXT OF MIKE'S POST AND MAKING SOMETHING ABUNDANTLY CLEAR: YOU DON'T INSULT MY FAMILY. I'M FAIR GAME...BUT YOU DON'T...INSULT...MY FAMILY. THAT IS THE LINE IN THE SAND THAT I DRAW FOR EVERYONE HERE, AND IT APPLIES TO YOU SAME AS EVERYONE ELSE. CROSS THE LINE AGAIN, YOU WILL BE OFFICIALLY SHROUDED. KEEP IT UP, YOU WILL BE DISEMVOWELED. DO NOT PULL THIS CRAP AGAIN.)
PAD
According to the most recent report on CNN (where they talk about the post-release press conference on hair...) these devices have been up for at least two weeks.
So it seems it took a while for the real paranoid people to notice them.
Pish posh, these things come with the territory.
Twas a bit of an odd event, though. The "bomb" was placed near a bank and contained additional warnings that the school and nearby community college would be targeted at 2:30 if demands were not met (no idea what said demands were).
By 10 or so they had determined that the bomb was a fake and no suspicious packages were found on either campus. Normally school would have continued, but the administration made the wise decision to send the kids home early. Oh you should have heard them protest! "But we want to learn!" they shouted. "Get the hell out of here you little heathens, lest I smite you about the head and shoulders, delivering a sound thrashing you will not soon forget!" I replied.
The thing is, we knew that rumors were beginning to fly, helicopters were circling around and all it would take is one cell phone call from a concerned parent to start the kind of mass panic that would have made the last 2 blocks impossible anyway so it was easier just to send them home. School began as usual the next day and would have done so today had Mother Nature not delivered her own Weapon of Mass Destruction in the form of a minor snow shower or, as it is called down south, "Nature's Icy Fury".
"They couldn't just look at one of them and see that it was a sign?"
Couldn't they have seen that it was just a thermos, lunch box, backpack or shipping package? No.
I have a good friend who is a bomb K-9. The officer aint too bad a guy to have around either. (waits for the groaning to stop) They get called out to check something, they have to check it.
Sometimes, as in rarely, that leads to the dog hitting on something when it's not actually a bomb. There are things out there (no, I'm not giving you the list) that will false positive a K-9. Something in the sign could have done that. BPD's bomb team would have to treat it as a threat at that point.
Not saying with that last bit that the guys meant to do that. Just saying that it has been known to happen.
Overall:
The idea was good.
The markiting guys not going through channels and getting the right permits was really dumb.
Turner not marking the ad devices with an easy to locate ownership information text to ID the things was kind of dumb.
Hiring to locals who knew the best areas to put them for the target group they wanted but who didn't seem to know where they could legally place ads was both good and bad.
BPD showing their skills off was pretty fun.
The stuff coming out of Boston's top officials right now is brain dead.
When I read that no panic ensued in any of the other cities where these things had been in place for weeks, I just assumed that there was at least one person working in Emergency Services in those cities who immediately recognized Err the Mooninite from Aqua Teen Hunger Force, contacted someone at the Cartoon Network, asked if they knew anything about it, and, when they were told it was an ad for the upcoming ATHF movie, spread the word that they were ads and were harmless.
Boston's reaction at this point looks like the mayor and chief of police are determined to punish someone--anyone--for making them look like idiots. I guess Boston didn't get any of the giant [adult swim] billboards with that exact image on them like Baltimore did...
While the ATHF people should have gone through regular channels (no permits were issued for these), I have to note that since this same type of campaign was done in several other cities (including New York City, where two 9/11 planes hit) and there was NO PANIC over them, I have to think the Boston situation was overreaction. Couldn't they have checked out these devices without shutting down everything? And after the first one, couldn't they have figures out what the others were?
"Couldn't they have checked out these devices without shutting down everything? And after the first one, couldn't they have figures out what the others were?"
Maybe. I would love to see what the final chain of command was on this thing and who was most pushing for the almost total lockdown of the city that ended up happening.
"It just seems like the authorties' first response was to call out the bomb squad. They couldn't just look at one of them and see that it was a sign?"
People are still thinking that the authorities' response was just post-9/11 paranoia - it wasn't! If you left a random device on public property before 9/11, the bomb squad would have been called. I know people who have had this happen to them!
Two other things have been clarified today:
1. There were *2* bomb "threats" yesterday. There were fake pipe bombs that were planted in a medical center and on the Longfellow bridge. An MBTA worker found the ATHF device, and police thought they might be linked. I don't begrudge them for being concerned.
2. Apparently the first ATHF ad device found near the Orange Line in Sullivan Square had only been there for 24 hours. It wasn't there for weeks as has been implied.
"Couldn't they have checked out these devices without shutting down everything?"
They didn't shut down "everything" - a few roads were closed, and a portion of the Red Line subway (which ran over the bridge where the fake pipe bomb was found) was also closed. Even if you're pretty sure the device isn't a bomb, you still have to close the roads so that workers can inspect the devices on ladders and man lifts. Aside from today's political posturing (which is ridiculous), it wasn't that big a deal.
I swear, people have the impression that Bostonians were shivering in their homes and saying last rights. Aside from the traffic nightmare and the over-the-top press coverage, most people's days went as normal.
To avoid a Joe Bideneaque error, let me just say Gwen was quite poised in the glare of public spotlight and possibility of imminent alien abduction. Plus the Lisa Loeb glasses were quite flattering.
-- Ken from Chicago (who's so old school he thought it was one of the Space Invaders)
P.S. So is this video clip saved in the David Family home movies vault?
I'M FAIR GAME...
I thought the offending comment was within that boundary.
It wasn't apparent to me the comment would be seen outside of that boundary, but it is your perception that makes the offense authentic. I do not reserve the privilege of repeating that mistake, and I am sorry.
I just want to say that i found it amusing that the best coverage of this story i ran across today was on CNN.
I just want to say that i found it amusing that the best coverage of this story i ran across today was on CNN.
"I thought the offending comment was within that boundary."
Now you know otherwise.
"It wasn't apparent to me the comment would be seen outside of that boundary, but it is your perception that makes the offense authentic. I do not reserve the privilege of repeating that mistake, and I am sorry."
Okay.
PAD
I cant help but think it was a overreaction in insane ways, and these city leaders are just making things worse for themselves. These things were in how many cities, I cant help but think that everyone that was in on the joke and knew what these things were harmless innocently figured others would catch on. It's sad that Boston city leaders just dont drop this, it just makes them look stupid that they were the only ones in 10 cities that actually made a big deal out of this.
First off--PAD, your daughter showed a great amount of poise and thoughtfulness in that interview. I don't recall there being a single "Uhm, er, well..." kind of a thing in there. Speaking as someone who works in TV, she handled herself really well. Better, in fact, than most of the people I know who work in TV.
Second off, not too many of the media news outlets that I've seen have mentioned that the BPD actually did find a pipe bomb or two, so their reaction versus other cities is almost understandable.
Haven't read all the comments yet, so this may have been mentioned already: I think Cartoon Network was trying to reproduce something I read about that occurred in Japan, where an artist places 'space invader' type figures on the sides of buildings and bridges and the like. I think that Toon Network should have stuck to simple paint instead of flashing billboards, just in case someone panicked.
In the (ironic) coverage of this on CNN yesterday, it's illuminating to see what the artists/advertisers are being charged with. They are being charged with committing a hoax, which is defined (I'm writing from memory here, so I'm paraphrasing) as an action intended to create fear, confusion, or the impression of danger. And like it or not, this does not apply in the slightest to the artists/advertisers. They wanted and intended to promote the show AQUA TEEN HUNGER FORCE; they didn't use this as a fake explosive ("Watch out show or we'll detonate this package") or design the products to look like bombs (more like Light Brite). So from a legal standpoint, these charges are totally warrantless.
(Of course, I'm sure those involved in the CBLDF have plenty of stories about the loose interpretation of laws to "get" people for whom there is an agenda.)
I gotta say, what this shows to me is that we're not vigilant enough in worrying about bombs. Several people plant strange electronic devices all over a city without telling anyone what they're doing, and everyone's claiming the police "overreacted"? Read about Ireland in the 1980s, and you'll see that we live in a world of absolute blithe obliviousness to the potential dangers of bombs.
The idea of, "Oh, the police should have _known_ they were safe because they had cute cartoon characters on them!" terrifies me much more than the police's reaction does. Terrorists rarely put "Mr. Yuck" stickers on their bombs. :)
Do I think these guys intended this to be taken as a bomb threat? Of course not. I don't think they thought at all. But I certainly don't want to encourage people to be less suspicous of strange devices planted in public places, and laying a bit of legal smackdown on people who did something extraordinarily stupid should help in that regard.
Realistically there is virtually nothing that can be done to prevent smeone from planting bombs, other than catching them before they do it. Bombs can be the size of coke cans or look like a crumpled paper bag. We should be so lucky that the terrorists would be dumb enough to thoughtfully add blinking lights.
The fact that there actually WERE bombs found mitigates the verreaction smewhat but it's still no excuse for the way they are treating these guys.
I find it humorous that out of alllll the cities that they did this ad campaign, only one had an issue.
Here in Texas (a most conservative god fearing, terrorist hating, paranoid state of states) we had no problem.
But it was in Austin and I am sure all those stoners and hippies knew very well what the Mooninite greeting of a pixelated middle finger means.
My only problem is that there has been talk that the Marketing company new the panic was ensuing and told one of the guys arested to keep quiet. It was not until someone notified the CN directly that the CN's marketing was causing this panic in Boston that anyone notified the police. And if the two gentleman arrested and the third party marketing company knew about their harmless boxes being the cause and kept silent? That's pathetic and they should be punished, they could have ended it earlier and chose not to.
Have seen the two guys hired to hang those signs? What a couple of greasy stoners. I'm now convinced more than ever that the biggest problem was that they were too baked to remember to tell the city government what they were doing.
Being aware of suspicious objects is like knowing not to take candy from strangers, walking alone in a rough neighborhood, or looking in both direction when you're crossing the street. You accept it as part of your life, learned from an early age, but without living in constant fear from everything and everybody. Such advice is not guarenteed to protect you from every threat, but it's still useful to practice.
Um, Peter?
Where's the exclamation point?
I was watching the news clip with Gwen, and wondered, has she abandoned the exclamation point at the end of her name as a relic of her childhood, decline to include it when speaking into the microphone to avoid confusion in the viewing public? Or did the graphics editors simply go, "Um..................uh-uh. I'm not putting that in there."?
As someone else who uses an exclamation point in their name, I can tell you that it is very difficult to get someone else to do it anywhere, let alone a news broadcast. Sure, they'll give anyone with some weird spelling of their name a pass (I saw a "Karyl" once, as opposed to "Carol"), but those of us who use some punctuation get no respect.
*sigh*
-eD!
And I suppose, next time, I should close my style tags properly, so that my post doesn't look stupid.
This is what I get for posting a comment when I'm in a rush to get to work, I suppose.
*double sigh*
-eD!
"My only problem is that there has been talk that the Marketing company new the panic was ensuing and told one of the guys arested to keep quiet."
To be fair, that's only a part of an email that they were sent. There have been other snippits of it read on the news that takes the punch out of the first reports of that line being held up as some form of intent to let the scare keep going. Even one of the MSNBC guests that was roasting these guys over the fire over this said that the entire email didn't read the way it was being played on some newscasts.
At this time I haven't seen the entire thing printed anywhere. I still think that those two guys and the ad company that hired them are dumb as bricks, but I'm holding off on accusing them of trying to keep the scare going.
I think in an era where bombs have blown up in cities, like London, and we hear about foiled plots to bomb airports and train stations, Boston had every right to come down hard on the dumb bells who arranged this promo piece. If they want to promote a show, take an add out in TV Guide
I thought Gwen had purple hair! I was looking forward to seeing how it'd show up on camera. :-(
Den said:
"The King always freaks me out."
-----
I think The King is really Chuckie.
AHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhhhhhhh.....
Unfortunately, one of the two artists arrested in Boston for placing the signs could be facing deportation over the incident--Peter Berdovsky is a Belarussian seeking asylum in the United States: "Under federal law, a non-citizen convicted of any crime of moral turpitude or aggravated felony in the United States is subject to deportation, and asylum is generally not granted in crimes with terrorist implications. Even if Berdovsky were given some kind of court-authorized plea bargain which would allow him not to be convicted, acknowledgment of complicity in a crime is tantamount to a conviction under federal immigration statutes, and would still lead to deportation. The only recourse Berdovsky would have is to either go to trial and be found not guilty or to have the state drop its case against him entirely."
In the back of my mind I wonder if Cartoon Network wasn't secretly hoping for an overreaction in one of the ten cities as just happened in Boston, as now everyone knows the words "Aqua Teen Hunger Force." On the other hand, I learned a long time ago never to ascribe malice to a situation that's best described as stupidity, and certainly Boston's reaction counts as stupidity. ;)
Frankly, if I were Turner Broadcasting I'd pay for the costs Boston incurred, perhaps offer some sort of art program to the local school district, and hope that these two moves soothe ruffled feathers. And if the ruffled feathers aren't soother, just pull the plug on broadcasting to Boston, as clearly they wasted their money on the Boston market. :)
El Hombre Malo posted:
"...ehrm...Peter, I mean, Mr.David...
...How old exactly your daughter is?"
-----
Think about it. Would you really want to date a woman whose father is good friends with Lou Ferrigno, whose father is smarter than most of the guys she would ever meet, and whose father undoubtedly bowls better than you?
Craig J. Ries posted:
"I'm already seeing comments from other people in MA wondering why the city is so full of dumbasses."
-----
'Cause they're Red Sox fans?
??
??
Think about it. Would you really want to date a woman whose father is good friends with Lou Ferrigno, whose father is smarter than most of the guys she would ever meet, and whose father undoubtedly bowls better than you?
Worse yet, he could tuckerize you in a most unflattering manner. ;)
Seriously though. Aside from the qustions arising from the situation itself, brava to Gwen for her poise in front of the camera. One could almost see a future for her there.
-Rex Hondo-
Bladestar posted:
"Natural Selection at work."
-----
That was cold, sir.
True also.
I said:
"I think The King is really Chuckie."
-----
Jeez, that might make more sense if I spelled it correctly.
Chucky.
AAAAAHHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhh! (again)
And, in a related development, cartoon character Daffy Duck has been placed on Logan International Airport's "no fly" list.
*rim shot*
Now, guys, this is really not a joking matter. As well as the city of Boston managed this particular situation, how thinly stretched and harried is the BPD going to be over all the suspicious "bouquets of flowers" and "boxes of chocolates" sure to be spotted over the next couple of weeks? Any of them could be a bomb or filled with anthrax! Heck, even if they focus only on the "Secret Admirer" packages, that could be hundreds, or even thousands of exploded roses, teddy bears, and Russell Stover's variety packs.
-Rex "Ever Vigilant" Hondo-
I saw this video on youtube and guessed that she was your daughter based on looks, vocation, and skill in the English language. Then when I watched it again I got all excited that I was right.
I’m going to save you any “dude, your daughter’s hot” comments, out of respect.
I saw this video on youtube and guessed that she was your daughter based on looks, vocation, and skill in the English language. Then when I watched it again I got all excited that I was right.
I’m going to save you any “dude, your daughter’s hot” comments, out of respect.
Peter, I hope you don't feel that my saying your daughter is "lovely" falls under the category of "dude, your daughter's hot." Someone once told me my sister is "cute" and I simply thought it was a nice compliment. I didn't punch him in the face until he asked me to hook them up. :)
(Besides, I'm 36. I don't know precisely how old Gwen is, but I believe I'm old enough to be her father. So when I look at the video, I find myself thinking, "There's a young lady who would make any father proud.")
(Shit, did I say that? Christ, I think I just became OLD!)
BTW, when I was in my early 20s, I worked part-time in my friend's comic-book store to help defray the costs of my comic-book habit. It was the most fun job I ever had. Whenever I stocked the shelves, put away back issues, or did inventory, it was like getting paid for doing my shopping. Those were the days...
Let's say these little devices were in some way harmful, but the authorities didn't take them seriously for exactly the reasons you've laid out. Do you mean to tell me the city's not gonna get sued??? C'mon!
Probably not. Sovereign immunity.
Kathleen may recall the incident at a ChattaCon back in the late 80s/early 90s when a con attendee who was (illegally) sleeping in his van in the parking garage across the street from the hotel forgot that he had left a costume prop - a long plastic tube partially filled with a Dayglow yellowish-green fluid and decorated with radiation and biohazard warning stickers - leaning against the van.
Next morning when i woke up and glanced out my hotel window, the entire street was full of assorted emergency vehicles and cops and firemen and CDC personnel from Atlanta and AEC personnel from Oak Ridge...
The guy sleeping in the van woke up, glanced out, saw the commotion, and "Br'er Rabbit he lay low and he don't say nothin'..."
Shut down half of downtown Chattanooga for hours on a Saturday morning.
// On one hand, it's kind of funny, but on the other, you can't be too careful. If the city wasn't aware that strange objects were going to be installed under bridges, then they were right in checking it out. //
Absolutly they should be checked out, but checking them out and shutting down a city, causing a panic are not even remotly the same thing.
// How dangerous do you think that could actually be?
Colleen Doran, creator, writer, and illustrator of "A Distant Soil," has offered her own unique perspective at her blog (www.adistantsoil.com/blog). She is the daughter of a police officer, and she says toys have been used to lure people to bombs before. So the people who reported the "Mooninite" devices weren't necessarily overreacting. //
And I agree, the people who reported it weren't overreacting, the officals who shut down the city were.
All I know is somewhere in the Universe Orson Welles is laughing his ass off.
Signs of sanity.
I've caught a couple of news blips that said that the charges against the stoners are being dropped. Good for them. I would have still fined them for some minor offenses, but the stuff being thrown at them by the city was just foolish.
"All I know is somewhere in the Universe Orson Welles is laughing his ass off."
:)
Posted by: Darren J Hudak at February 3, 2007 11:52 AM
Absolutly they should be checked out, but checking them out and shutting down a city, causing a panic are not even remotly the same thing.
The vast majority of Boston wasn't "shut down" and I have yet to read about actual "panic" on any significant scale. So I'm not sure what incident or which city you're referring to, but it certainly can't be the "Mooninite attack" in Boston.
And it's funny how all of a sudden everyone with a PC and an Internet connection has become a bomb detection and removal expert. As opposed to Jerry Chandler, whose only piddly little credential is that he's, y'know, an actual bona fide police officer.
To be fair to everyone else, I'm no bomb tech or K-9. I'm getting some of my stuff from academy training and later classes, but anything advanced that I might ever add to an explosives discussion is from my picking the brain of our explosives K-9 guys. I'm kinda doing what others here are doing and turning to the experts for information before commenting.
Still, I will agree that I know enough (or am biased enough) to think that BPD didn't get too crazy in their response. They were dealing with an unknown device that no one was claiming ownership of and had, from what I've seen so far, no easily identifiable ownership markings on the device. I've also not seen anything yet on who was calling the shots by the time things reached their full blown silliness. Did the decision to go nuclear come from the Chief of the BPD or from the Mayor's office?
You've also got to realize that we get more stuff dumped on us about what nuts on the net are talking about doing then you might think. Some of them are sharing tips about stuff that you could find in the Anarchist's Cookbook, but others are putting up how-to guides on bomb attacks from other countries where bikes were turned into pipe bombs and stuffed animal toys were used to house an explosive device. Add to that level of almost daily paranoia inducing information feeds the fact that we get about ten to fifteen "law enforcement only" alerts and homeland security terror warnings for every one that you hear about and you have a situation where coincidence may put all the wrong things together in the wrong place at the wrong time. I don't know what the Boston area may or may not have been getting lately, but that is one possibility or what happened here. No one got hurt, killed, hit with a 50,000 volts or OC sprayed here, so I'm on the side of cutting them some slack unless some news breaks that puts them in a bad light about what they knew and what they did.
Oh, I'm also not sure at the moment if my above post is correct. It was on MSNBC late last night and this morning that I saw them say that the hoax device stuff and the other more extreme/silly charges against the two stoners were being dropped. Just now, they were discussing the situation on an MSNBC roundtable as if the charges hadn't been dropped but may be plea bargained or dropped down the road.
Jerry, you are correct that I was being a bit simplistic. I did note that you were not an explosives expert. But the fact that you're a cop, that you studied explosives as part of your training, and that you know a guy on the K-9 unit gives you far more credibility in my eyes than "Joe Q. Anybody" declaring, "They should've known it wasn't a bomb." And to be fair, some people have been making statements similar to that.
Oh, and you wanna talk about overreacting? Bill Mulligan called the bomb squad and had them detonate a fruit cake I mailed to him for Christmas. It was in an unsuspicious package clearly marked "Fruit Cake for Bill Mulligan From Bill Myers."
I mean, if you don't like fruitcake, Bill, you could've just said so.
Bill, Mulligan just knows your COOKING. Not an overreaction at all. And he's still talking to me, so he can't be COMPLETELY against fruitcake, right?
My, are those loud crickets I hear?
Something that's been bouncing around in my head is asking to come out. Did the BPD REALLY overreact to this, or is the overreaction actually by the news media? I'm willing, more than willing, to give the police the benefit of the doubt, the fact that they didn't have anyone that recognized ATHF notwithstanding. Still, I think CN should've had either a contact number on the backs.
Oh, and you wanna talk about overreacting? Bill Mulligan called the bomb squad and had them detonate a fruit cake I mailed to him for Christmas. It was in an unsuspicious package clearly marked "Fruit Cake for Bill Mulligan From Bill Myers."
What Mr Myers conviently leaves out is that chunks of the destroyed fruitcake badly injured two people and caused serious damage to a lovely car. What was that thing made from--concrete and bullets?
That's a good point about recognition, Sean. I'm a total geek. As a matter of fact, I'm far and away the biggest geek in my department. I've seen the odd ep of ATHF before, but never really took to it. Even being a total geek and having seen it, I didn't know what the hell I was looking at until the newsreader holding the Space Invader Light-Brite up to the camera said that it was a Mooninite mock up ad for ATHF: The Movie. Can anybody say for sure that anybody at work for the BPD that day could even tell you what the hell ATHF even was?
Count your blessings, Mulligan. I've seen fruitcake related incidents that would wake you from a sound sleep screaming like a new born. You didn't overreact at all.
If anything, you didn't go far enough. What foolish dolt thought that a mere standard detonation would destroy such a threat? Only by journying to Kitchen Doom and returning it through the gawping mouth of hellish oven from which it was spawned and into the fires within can one finally destroy one of the damned things and break its reign of terror.
You got off lucky, my friend.
Okay, now I'm frustrated. Having heard so much of the inestimable Ms. David here, I followed the link - and can't find the video in question. So I tried YouTube, as mentioned above - and can't come up with any search terms (including the clip's original designation) that will cough it up. Does anyone have a current link to the video?
Jonathan,
Go to the link, look on the right side of the site for the search tag over the video selections and enter "comic store employees" (without the quotes) into the search engine. Look for the one about the hoax. Should be the first or second that comes up.
// Absolutly they should be checked out, but checking them out and shutting down a city, causing a panic are not even remotly the same thing.
The vast majority of Boston wasn't "shut down" //
That's the way it was described in more then one news source. Shuting down an major roadway and shutting down a city can be a spiltting hairs thing, especially if you sitting in the traffic that's cause as a result, or you losing bussiness because of the roads being closed.
// and I have yet to read about actual "panic" on any significant scale.//
Then you must of missed all the news headlines with catchy phases like, "panic in boston". or "Terror scare brings city to standstill". And it wasn't the boxes that caused whatever panic and shutdown there was, it was the media and the officals. Even after the boxes were found to be harmless officals from the city were on the news saying things like this could be a terrorist dry run.
// So I'm not sure what incident or which city you're referring to, but it certainly can't be the "Mooninite attack" in Boston. //
Again, not the way it was presented in most news account, nor the impression given from the city's own officals.
Posted by Darren J Hudak at February 3, 2007 07:07 PM
That's the way it was described in more then one news source. Shuting down an major roadway and shutting down a city can be a spiltting hairs thing, especially if you sitting in the traffic that's cause as a result, or you losing bussiness because of the roads being closed.
That's like saying the difference between one and one thousand is "splitting hairs." Shutting some major roadways is a far cry from shutting down an entire city.
I live in the Rochester, N.Y., area. About 16 or 17 years ago we had a bad-ass ice storm that really shut the city down (hell, it shut down multiple COUNTIES). Authorities were ticketing anyone dumb enough to try to drive on the ice-covered roadways. EVERYTHING was closed except for emergency services. EVERYTHING. THAT is shutting a city down. What happened in Boston didn't come close. That is not splitting hairs, that is pointing out two vastly different situations.
Posted by Darren J Hudak at February 3, 2007 07:07 PM
Then you must of missed all the news headlines with catchy phases like, "panic in boston". or "Terror scare brings city to standstill". And it wasn't the boxes that caused whatever panic and shutdown there was, it was the media and the officals. Even after the boxes were found to be harmless officals from the city were on the news saying things like this could be a terrorist dry run.
I used to be a reporter. I know how to spot typical media spew, and that's what that was. Looking past the hyperbole, I read NOTHING to indicate there was an actual mass panic. Nobody was fleeing the city in terror, looting stores, or anything like that.
Posted by Darren J Hudak at February 3, 2007 07:07 PM
Again, not the way it was presented in most news account, nor the impression given from the city's own officals.
That's the difference between spew and substance. The media and city officials were spewing, but if you look past the spew to see the actual substance, there was no mass panic. Fear, maybe. Concern, certainly. But no panic.
I think the people who are really overreacting are the people accusing the BPD of overreacting.
To Bill Mulligan, Jerry Chandler, & Sean Scullion: Fine. No fruitcake for you next Christmas.
Bill Mulligan and Jerry--
SEE? Toldja it'd work. But NO, don't believe me...
Okay, more things bouncing around in my head that wanna come out and play. Could it be that the hair-driven news conference was the two guys' attempt to point out that in addition to their not being able to discuss this, there are bigger things going on in the world than a couple of guys putting up light boards? Or am I just being too generous?
// That's the way it was described in more then one news source. Shuting down an major roadway and shutting down a city can be a spiltting hairs thing, especially if you sitting in the traffic that's cause as a result, or you losing bussiness because of the roads being closed.
That's like saying the difference between one and one thousand is "splitting hairs." Shutting some major roadways is a far cry from shutting down an entire city.
I live in the Rochester, N.Y., area. About 16 or 17 years ago we had a bad-ass ice storm that really shut the city down (hell, it shut down multiple COUNTIES). Authorities were ticketing anyone dumb enough to try to drive on the ice-covered roadways. EVERYTHING was closed except for emergency services. EVERYTHING. THAT is shutting a city down. What happened in Boston didn't come close. That is not splitting hairs, that is pointing out two vastly different situations. //
It's all a matter of perspective. I live in NJ, where a few years ago a water main break on the New Jersey Parkway, (one of the two major highways in the state), that happend just as the morning rush hour was starting brought things to such a standstill that many people were 5 hours late for work. (I was one of the lucky ones, I was only two and half hours late for work). A radio new announcher described it as "practically bringing the state to a halt" and advised people who didn't have to get to the office to "stay home". If someone had said it "closed down the state for a while" I certainly wouldn't have argued, nor would others who were sitting in traffic, unable to move forward or turn around, nor would private bussiness or government offices that found themselves unable to function because thier employees litterally couldn't get there. Technically things weren't "Shut down", in reality they might of well have been. OTOH, on 911, NYC was really shut down, as shut down as any city could be, yet many bussiness, (like supermarkets, some of which are owned by the company I work for) stayed open. And I have friends who live and worked in Manhatan who managed to make it into NYC or out of NYC, (depending on where they were), even though it was "Shut down". (Mind you they had to do it on foot but......). So again I would argue that there are different levels of "Shut down" and that it's sometimes a matter of perspective.
Posted by: Jerry Chandler at February 3, 2007 02:46 PM
They were dealing with an unknown device that no one was claiming ownership of and had, from what I've seen so far, no easily identifiable ownership markings on the device.
Except for, y'know, the big blinking Mooninite, which a lot of people apparently found fairly recognizable, since they were up for a couple of weeks (The ones that weren't pulled down and promptly put up on ebay) before anybody called the police.
Now, I'll readily concede that once called, the police likely had to act within certain regulations, whether anybody on the force recognized the Mooninites or not, and particularly if the whole situation occurred on a day when actual devices were found. But the city and state officials' reactions after the fact were pretty over-the-top.
There are real threats out there, but I worry about getting to a point where people see bombs in every forgotten purse, bag of litter, and delivery box. Such a state of hyper-vigilance can't be maintained indefinitely. There has to be a way to remain watchful without jumping at every shadow or trying litterers as suspected terrorists.
Posted by: Darren J Hudak at February 3, 2007 08:55 PM
So again I would argue that there are different levels of "Shut down" and that it's sometimes a matter of perspective.
Tell me about it. Living within a couple of miles of Indianapolis Motor Speedway, I'm smack in the middle of the traffic lockdown that occurs a couple times a year for a few hours after a big race, and Indianapolis police are not terribly impressed that I work at a hospital downtown and have to go that way to get there.
-Rex Hondo-
To Bill Mulligan, Jerry Chandler, & Sean Scullion: Fine. No fruitcake for you next Christmas.
Well, not so fast; my driveway has a big pothole.
"Except for, y'know, the big blinking Mooninite, which a lot of people apparently found fairly recognizable, since they were up for a couple of weeks (The ones that weren't pulled down and promptly put up on ebay) before anybody called the police."
You have to know what a Mooninite is to know you're looking at someting to do with ATHF or Cartoon Network. I like some of Cartoon Networks stuff, I've seen a couple eps back whne it started and I didn't know what the hell it was. The only thing from the show I might recognize is the big red head thing and the food guys.
You're also going under the idea that everybody saw the things from day one. Well, people see things for days at a time before they actuallt "see" what they're looking at. Change your hair, shave your beard or get new glasses and it may be a full week before people you know or work with are asking you, "say, have you...."
Change something very small in a work enviroment without telling anyone and many people may not notice it for weeks. Stick a tiny device up on a building in a major city and likely 9 out of ten people may never notice it.
I doubt that there's aposter here who can say that he/she hasn't slapped their head in wonder at the people around them for failing to notice something for days on end that was right there in front of their faces. I also doubt that there's a poster here who hasn't been the blind man at least a few times themselves. I'll admit that I have.
And who knows what they thought when they started finding out that they had odd looking unkown electronic devices planted on buildings and bridges all over town and no one was stepping forward to claim ownership? The big screw up here was no one thinking to get all their stuff in order and getting permits or letting the need-to-know people know what was up before M-Day hit.
"But the city and state officials' reactions after the fact were pretty over-the-top."
No argument there. No argument at all. I've said as much myself. They've been sounding nuts with some of statements coming out of City Hall and with what they've been talking about charging the stoners with.
// Change something very small in a work enviroment without telling anyone and many people may not notice it for weeks. Stick a tiny device up on a building in a major city and likely 9 out of ten people may never notice it. //
I'm reminded of the first season of the new Doctor Who where the doctor explains that he never fixed the circuit that allowed the Tardis to change shape because he liked a blue box, stick a blue box anywhere and people tend to walk right past it.
Posted by: Jerry Chandler at February 3, 2007 11:07 PM
You have to know what a Mooninite is to know you're looking at someting to do with ATHF or Cartoon Network.
The same could be said of any trademarked or copywrited (sp?) character, emblem, or logo. The fact that whoever called the "device" in and the bulk of the BPD apparently fall pretty far outside ATHF's target demographic doesn't change the fact that it's clearly recognizable as a particular character from a specific show.
Now, without knowing the pertinent statutes covering advertising or exactly where the devices were found, I can't know for sure whether or not the "perps" legally needed to notify somebody any more than a person putting up "lost puppy" posters.
Also, not knowing the exact timeline, it's entirely possible Cartoon Network and Turner Broadcasting didn't even know there was an issue until they were called, their offices not being in Boston. As I recall, they didn't have any trouble claiming ownership of the ads when asked about them.
Also, again witout knowing the precise placement of the ads, one can assume fairly safely that, being part of a marketing campaign, they were placed to be seen. Again, we're not talking a "tiny device up on a building in a major city." They were bright blinking signs. If they genuinely went unnoticed for two weeks, then either the people of Boston are unbelieveably oblivious, or they guys responsible put them in the most piss-poor places imaginable.
Of course, it's pretty much a moot point if the charges are dropped, which they should be. Also, though they can't do it too openly, the CN folks have got to just be pissing themselves in glee over all the free advertising they got out of this. For the price of a few LEDs, there's hardly a person in this country who hasn't heard of Aqua Teen Hunger Force now.
Of course, I feel I should note, if it should come to light that somebody on staff at CN called in the bomb scare themselves, they deserve whatever happens to them.
I'm also curious to see if the Boston beauraucrats actually cool their jets or if they try to pressure theaters into not showing the movie when it comes out.
-Rex Hondo-
Is it just me, or does that Boston channel have the same "5" logo as Babylon 5?
Can anyone give me a link to a picture of one of these litle ditties? Preferably one with other objects in it so i can get an idea of the size?
E-mail it to me at fairportfan@gmail.com, if so.
I've been a customer of that store for a year and a half. How many times have I bought comics from Peter David's daughter without realizing it?? My life has changed forever.
Mike W, without hunting down a comparative photo, I do know you can find them fairly quick by checking the ones that are being auctioned on ebay.
-Rex Hondo-
"...doesn't change the fact that it's clearly recognizable as a particular character from a specific show."
No, it doesn't. But you seem to be missing the point I was making about ownership ID. I haven't seen one picture of these things were you could see, front or back, anything referencing a trademark, copyright, Cartoon Network, Turner or ATHF itself. Nor have I read anything that would lead one to believe that these things had any of that in any sort of viewable area. See, this presents two problems in my mind.
The first one is how poorly this thing was conceived as an advertisement. What use is an advertisement that doesn't advertise a product? The only people who would look at these things and see a Mooninite are people who watch the show. No one who who is unfamiliar with the show would see anything other then an odd looking Lite-Brite or pay it no mind at all. Way to grab new fans there.
The second problem is what I touched on above. You may be facing a real problem if you find a strange looking device that nobody is claiming and you can't ID the item, what it's meant to be or the owner. People here have brought up VCRs and such as items that could be seen sitting on the street as example of devices with wires and whatnot. Not quite the same. Most people can tell you what that is, ID its function, see things like brand names and serial numbers on it and take a somewhat safe guess that it may have been junked. These things had nothing to ID them and they were unique items. Kinda like homemade bombs and stuff.
"Now, without knowing the pertinent statutes covering advertising or exactly where the devices were found, I can't know for sure whether or not the "perps" legally needed to notify somebody any more than a person putting up "lost puppy" posters."
Yeah, but, in my experience, there are some things that are pretty close to universal. You don't hang banners or ads from major bridges without getting a permit from the locality. Several news stories spoke of one or more of these things being on a bridge. They also pointed out that this was a no-no in the Greater Boston area.
You should also get permission from a building owner if you wish to put something on their building. From the interview PAD linked and from the film that the guys shot of themselves putting these things up after dark (And has anybody even heard anything about BPD talking about or looking for the third guy that was filming them as they put these things up?) they were just walking around the city sticking them wherever they thought would be a cool place to put one. Correct me if I'm wrong here because my dial up is useless for double checking the interview, but didn't Gwen say that they didn't know about the thing being put up until after it was there? And I've seen a few other remarks like that in the news coverage.
The guys screwed up. They should have gotten permits or permission to put the things on the bridge (city property) and on some of the buildings (private property) to avoid confused looks by owners and calls to somebody to have the things removes. Had they done this, then none of the devices would have remained "unknown" longer then it took to ask a property owner if they knew what was hanging on their property.
"Also, not knowing the exact timeline, it's entirely possible Cartoon Network and Turner Broadcasting didn't even know there was an issue until they were called, their offices not being in Boston. As I recall, they didn't have any trouble claiming ownership of the ads when asked about them.'
Doesn't change what I said. If Turner or CN didn't know that their stuff was at the heart of the scare, then it changes nothing in regards to BPD having strange looking devices that no one was claiming ownership of. That they claimed ownership when someone guessed what the things were and asked them is all fine and good, but how fast do you think that would have been done if the ads were better marked or the stoners told everybody whose property they were sticking the things on what they were putting up? Again, it goes back to a screw up by the people putting the things together and putting them up.
"...or if they try to pressure theaters into not showing the movie when it comes out."
In which case the officials should be made fun of in South Park ASAP. Actually, I'll bet you money that Parker and Stone have already started their Boston episode just based on this mess as we type.
You'd think the ad agency would have included something about a copyright/trademark notice in the specs for the signs. Perhaps putting the [adult swim] logo under the figure of Err wouldn't have been practical, but I can't imagine that it would have busted the budget to print up some stickers that said "TM & (c) 2007 Cartoon Network. All rights reserved" and stick 'em on the boxes.
And, again, I guess Boston didn't get any of the giant billboards with a censored image of Err shooting the bird like we did in the Baltimore area (I saw one from my doctor's office window in December)--no other copy, just a picture of Err with a "CENSORED" banner over his raised finger and a small [as] logo in the corner.
Just read the report that the longer-haired sign putter-upper filmed the bomb squad in the area that they'd put up one of the Moonilites. Now, as I'm sure everyone will attest to, when we're immersed in our respective art/passions/whatever, we can all get kind of clueless, but does anyone buy the idea that this guy didn't know the bomb squad was about to send his project into the Land Of Million Pieces And Primer Cord? Now, before anyone thinks I'm jumping all over these guys, I could tell you of any of the various times at shows and while editing people remember having complete two-way intelligent conversations with me that I can in no way attest to, having only remembered what I was either writing, filming, or editing. But for him to film the squad doing it? Don't think it lends plausibility to his case.
BTW, never seen this show. Is it any good? Last thing I watched with any regularity on Adult Swim was Trigun.
Just read the report that the longer-haired sign putter-upper filmed the bomb squad in the area that they'd put up one of the Moonilites. Now, as I'm sure everyone will attest to, when we're immersed in our respective art/passions/whatever, we can all get kind of clueless, but does anyone buy the idea that this guy didn't know the bomb squad was about to send his project into the Land Of Million Pieces And Primer Cord? Now, before anyone thinks I'm jumping all over these guys, I could tell you of any of the various times at shows and while editing people remember having complete two-way intelligent conversations with me that I can in no way attest to, having only remembered what I was either writing, filming, or editing. But for him to film the squad doing it? Don't think it lends plausibility to his case.
BTW, never seen this show. Is it any good? Last thing I watched with any regularity on Adult Swim was Trigun.
Posted by Sean Scullion at February 6, 2007 11:34 PM
BTW, never seen this show. Is it any good?
I know it's not a terribly useful answer, but it depends on which season you catch. It started out fairly rough, but was pretty good for a couple of seasons. Then, much like Ren & Stimpy, it seemed to descend into just weird for weird's sake, but still with a bright spot here and there.
As to the incident, if this guy actually thought it would be a bright idea to film the bomb squad, I may just have to retract a lot of what I've said up to this point. CN needs to distance themselves from these yahoos as much as possible, like, yesterday, before it comes out that one of them actually did call it in to the police, just for the publicity.
-Rex Hondo-
They were in some places for 2 or 3 weeks. How long does a bomb need to be in place before it goes off? Had it been an actual terrorist device, people would now be dead.
I'm not buying the concept that a silly cartoon pulling a goofy advertising stunt is the problem.
I do think the story need a cop with a Monthy Python accent asking "Right! What's all this then?"
Posted by: Rob at February 7, 2007 08:43 PM
They were in some places for 2 or 3 weeks. How long does a bomb need to be in place before it goes off? Had it been an actual terrorist device, people would now be dead.
How would the bomb squad know how long the devices had been in place?
And your credentials as a bomb technician are... what, exactly?
Posted by: Rob at February 7, 2007 08:43 PM
I do think the story need a cop with a Monthy Python accent asking "Right! What's all this then?"
Actually, I think a more appropriate ending would be that line from a Steve Martin's Grandmother's Song: "Criticize things you don't know about..."
Peter, I was actually on the air for Channel 5 explaining what Aqua Teen Hunger Force was (somewhat embarassing, no?) while we were interviewing your daughter... she did a fantastic job! The little wave at the end of her live interview was classic. And yes, I did take advantage of that 50% off sale!