It's the official comments thread for "Hulk #77," out this week.
Whad'ja think?
Posted by Peter David at January 6, 2005 03:09 AM | TrackBack | Other blogs commentingYou know what I think? I think that A) the comics were delayed cuz of new years and B) its gonna be delayed again because of snow & ice tomorrow and C) I gotta wait until Friday to read it
Therefore? I think AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!
I enjoyed the issue and can't wait for more!
PAD: great balance of words and lack of words. And WOW -- some HULK/BRUCE INTERACTION (past and present) I've been SO starved for that! Best part of the whole issue. Bruce wants to be a hero? The Hulk (when interacting with teen Bruce) as a pacifist? I'm so eager to delve into Bruce and Hulk's psyche(s) again! Thank you! Even though it's not January 14th yet, you coming back to TIH is a great birthday gift!!
Lee Weeks: your rendition of the green Hulk is growing on me more and more, but I must say that your Kirby-esque grey Hulk/Hulk prime is FANTASTIC!!!!!
Tom Palmer: nice job with the inks. Glad to see you on Hulk some more.
Tom Brevoort: very nicely done issue overall. Well worth the money, and I'm gonna keep buying and spread the word. And I haven't said that about most comics for years now, unfortunately.
Studio F did well too; coloring was appropriate underwater and out of water.
I can't wait for next ish'!
I thought the issue was great, the art, the coloring, the writing.
One question I do have, why is Bruce wearing that knit cap in class? Isn't he a nerd? He looked like the Banner on the run from Jones' run more than a kid in a HS school class. Unless it was some sort of flashback with the adult Banner? Was that something I missed? Anyone?
The Gray Hulk was cool at the end as well, the lung thing not so cool.
Bruno
Bruno
As I said elsewhere...
I really liked the subtext in the school scene where young Bruce shows his contempt for his own imperfections, which are represented by the Hulk, and the Hulk in turn is angry at Banner for his derision. Since Banner and the Hulk are really one and the same, the conflict between them boils down to Banner beating himself up. Basically, low-self esteem. A very clever way of showing that.
I don't get it? Who was they big green guy running around in the Hulk book?? What was up with the pages of action and not just people talking, and talking and talking? *wink* Love this issue glad to have you back, I'll stay if you will!
I'm a lil confused by everything but I think I figured out where the Grey Hulk came from. Hulk puked him up on the beach....hahahahaha...great stuff!!!
Fun read! I had the opportunity to meet Lee Weeks at the Big apple Con in NYC back in November and he had copies of his artwork from this issue there. Impressive in color, but mind-blowing to see his pencils up close. This looks to be another great run.
Fred
Unfortunately, despite the fact that I added the title to my pull list, I didn't get a copy; and my store had sold out of what was on the shelves. The question, of course, is how many did they order? If they ordered a lot, which all sold out, that's probably a good sign, from your point of view. On the other hand, if they only ordered a handful, including the one meant for me, I guess it's still a good sign, just not as impressive, sales-wise.
The owner of my store said he'll try to find me a copy, which is nice and all; but to my way of thinking, you put the copies for the pull customers in their bins first, _then_ you put the rest on the shelves. I recently found a book I'd special ordered on the shelf instead of in my bin. The only copy, too. If someone had happened to pick it up out of curiosity, I'd never have seen it.
Anyway, I'm sure I'll like the issue when and if I see it.
Rick
Surely PAD must know whether he is permenant writer on Hulk by now? If not are we to expect a short hiatus whilst new issues were done?
As for a regular art team my vote would be for Lee Weeks, its' been ages since we had a stable art team you could rely on.
Ian
"Unfortunately, despite the fact that I added the title to my pull list, I didn't get a copy; and my store had sold out of what was on the shelves. The question, of course, is how many did they order? If they ordered a lot, which all sold out, that's probably a good sign, from your point of view. On the other hand, if they only ordered a handful, including the one meant for me, I guess it's still a good sign, just not as impressive, sales-wise."
My guess, based upon retailer draws for "The End," is that your retailer under-ordered it. I'm not new, I'm not flavor-of-the-month, and I'm not British, and since the major selling point of the book was me, I suspect sales cruised nicely under retailer radar.
PAD
I was very impressed by it. I am surprised that it was so fresh and interesting. I was afraid PAD was going to be burnt out on the HULK. Look forward to the series!
This appears to be the incarnation PAD left off with. A sort of Savage Hulk with Grey Hulk's attitude.
My retailer always has Hulk books and had a stack of issue #77 today. Even when Bruce Jones's run was selling high, each of the two shops I buy from
always had a stack of leftover Hulk issues.
I loved this first issue and the new power makes for great possibilities and increases Hulk's potential. I really hope PAD stays on indefinitely.
Since I was literally snowed in yesterday here in Iowa, I have to wait until after work to go find my copy. Hope it does not sell out. (The customer service challenged store here (the only one selling new comics in about 50 miles) told me in November that they could not add me yet to a pull list for the comics I want. Since the other store here went out of business, they had too many come over to their store. Fine, I can understand it would take a few weeks to work through it all. But they don't even take your name and sub list to add as soon as they can. They told me to wait until January and they *might* be able to add me. Of course, they promise they *always* buy enough copies of everything. Funny, though, how 3 of the comics I have gone in to buy have already been sold out. And you wonder why some comic stores go out of business .... Ok, sorry, my rant is over).
Jim in Iowa
Don't have a lot of time to discuss it, but I loved it.
Best book of the week. No one else should be allowed to write The Hulk.
It was like seeing a good old friend after a number of years and resuming the friendship without any awkwardness. Peter, I hope that you are named as permanent writer on the book. I also loved the artist, Lee Weeks.
Hats off also to another great issue of SOULSEARCHERS AND COMPANY. It was great getting a double blast of Peter David in one week. Great Kubert gag.
It's like the last seven years never happened. PAD, the last issue of Hulk I read was your last. This one could have easily come a month after that.
Glad to have you back.
The good thing about my comic store (Amazing Fantasy) is that we had a snow storm yesterday (I can relate, Jim, I'm in Illinois), so there were still a good 30 issues (guessing) left. I wanted to drive to the comic store yesterday during my lunch break at work, but the weather was getting worse by the minute. Any other time, it would take exactly thirty minutes to drive to the comic store and back. It would've taken a good hour or more yesterday.
This was a great read, long overdue. Welcome back, Peter!
I'm trying very hard not read any poster's descriptions of the happenings in the story because my comic shop won't get their new order until Friday as well, but I can not remember being this excited and looking forward to a new issue this much in a long, long time.
PAD, is there any word on what will happen to the title once your 6 issues are done? Does Marvel have another story ready to go while they decide who become's the Hulk's regular creative team? Will the title go on hiatus after your arc?
Loved it. The interweaving of past and present were well done and enjoyable, as were the Hulk/Banner interchanges.
And Monster Island! Yay!
Please, please make Marvel keep you on for more than 6 issues.
Okay, I'm one of those bleeding fanboys who had the usual inner climax at the thought of you coming back to the Hulk. Just remember that when it was first announced that you'd be taking the title after Bryne's (whatever happenned), that you were coming off of an improved Justice and an awesome Spectacular Spider-man run (and a bunch of other things back then) so I for one was waiting with bated breath, and your run (obviously) made an impression.
And here you are again, with another run, starting with another interesting take on the Banner/Hulk relationship, an interesting couple of mysteries and none of the over-slow burn of Mr. Jones.
Don't get me wrong, I like a lot of what Bruce Jones was doing but he was taking to long getting anywhere near the point. I mean Robert Ludlum books are full of slow burn kinds of events piling up on top of each but the pay-off is usually worth it. I don't think the pay off was worth it (or maybe it was rushed or something) during Mr. Jones run.
So far so good, and I can't wait for more. I would put it on my pull list but anything Hulk is forever on my pull list, so whaddayagonnado?
I thought it was terrific... except... well... what exactly happened to that shark on the first couple of pages? Did he blow up or what?
I liked it. Dramatic. I haven't read any Hulk since your last issue either. No, wait, I tried reading some of Byrne's Hulk. I was mad he ignored your continuity.
Can't wait for more. Decompressed storytelling is frustrating, like Heinz Ketchup.
BTW, I've been looking around on the Web, but can't figure it out - did they revive Betty Banner? Is she alive? Anyone know?
Very Very Good. Been waiting for the real Hulk to return for awhile. Nice paceing, Nice Art, Nice Monster Isle. None of the bad Jones era stuff. Thank you PAD.
As for Betty... I think the Leader, who was supposedly "Dead" twice over, was revealed to have ressurected Betty, but also gave her plastic surgery so she looks like the actress who played her in the movie...
I don't mean to break into the uninterrupted praise, but it was ... all right. Not great, but better than the end of Jones's run. Not as good as most of your initial run, but still pretty good. Enough to make me pick up the second issue, but I'm reserving judgment for now. It's definitely not as good as Fallen Angel, but I suppose you know that. Anyway, specifically, do we even know how Hulk goes back to Bruce anymore? I guess it's when he calms down, but who knows. And what's up with the weird mutant squid? I assume it's tied into the whole Monster Island (which is actually a peninsula!) thing. I didn't like the lame Daredevil joke, but I'll let it slide. It's a good book, but I trust you to make sure answers will be forthcoming. It's an okay start. Good to see you back on the big green/gray fella. On a slightly different topic, I was reading a post on Comics Should be Good about "Big Events" in a writer's run on a title, and they said after #425, your run went downhill, partly because of artistic inconsistency. I just wonder if you felt that you still had good stories to tell after, say, "The Troyan (sp?) War" and that Marvel's cross-over insanity ruined them. Just wondering.
Couldn't wait for my monthly shipment of comics so I traveled across town and picked an issue up.
Ahhhh, feels just like home. Great beginning of a story and some great artwork from Weeks. Good to see the 'classic' Hulk back.
Quoth Darin:
I thought it was terrific... except... well... what exactly happened to that shark on the first couple of pages? Did he blow up or what?
The Hulk ripped it in half. I think he was even eating some of it...
~G., who enjoyed the book and all that delicious subtext
Jon writes: It's like the last seven years never happened.
Well, if Peter actually has the audacity to go through with that wild idea he was telling me about, it'll be more than seven years...
...no, no. I've said too much.
Loved it. Been a long time since I enjoyed the Hulk this much. It was the first thing I read of my new stack, and loved every page, every panel, every word. Welcome back.
Re: Hulk #77
Over all I really enjoyed the issue. It's good to to have PAD back on the Hulk. I also really liked the art. The cover was just *ahem* incredible.
Quick question though, What was Hulk doing at the bottom of the sea? Is that where Jones left him at the end of his run? (I haven't read the Hulk since PAD left the first time) Or is that something that will be explained as the story unfolds?
One more quick question, I also bought "The New Avengers" #2 when I bought Hulk #77 and noticed they had a letters page. Are the Avengers an exception or does Marvel have plans to bring back all letter pages?
I thought the issue was great, everything I wanted it to be! And more importantly, I can't wait for the next issue. My local retailers ordered it pretty heavily, so I hope the issues sell out, and we can get Peter back full time on Hulk.
BTW, thanks for stopping in on the comicboards.com Hulk board, which have suddenly exploded. X-men fans have Claremont, Hulk fans have PAD.
Great first issue, PAD. It had just the right amount of drama and action. I enjoyed getting a further glympse into Bruce Banner's teenage years, a part of his life that has remained largely unexplored. I can't wait to see what events from the past will be uncovered, and what effect they will have on the present and future of both Bruce and the Hulk.
Speaking of the green guy, it's a relief to see that the Hulk once again has a personality--an INDEPENDENT personality--for this story. I'm also thrilled that you have brought the unending inner conflict of the character back to the forefront where it belongs.
The confrontations with the sea monster and the two-headed creature were a treat, but the greatest thrill was the appearance of the original gray Hulk at the end! Very cool! It seems fitting; this is essentially a new beginning for the Hulk, and through this incarnation you're taking the character back to his roots.
Overall, #77 was definitely worth the wait AND the hype. Keep up the great work, PAD! I'm eagerly awaiting #78. :-)
--Don aka Ygor
And what's up with the weird mutant squid?
Haven't seen the issue yet, but now I'm flashing on an episode of the (somewhat lame) Teen Titans cartoon:
"Bumblebee! Release the mind-controlled squid!"
I've got a very limited experience with Hulk. I picked it up because of my pleased experiences with Madrox and Fallen Angel.
... I must admit to having no idea what's going on.
Otherwise, though, I liked Bruce in school, and the way the Hulk was visualized. I'll be buying the next one and hoping it makes a bit more sense to me.
This was a fun first issue. I really enjoyed it and I'm looking forward to the rest!
> Nivek wrote: BTW, thanks for stopping in on the comicboards.com Hulk board, which have suddenly exploded.
I second that, PAD.
> Nivek wrote: X-men fans have Claremont, Hulk fans have PAD.
This just keeps getting better and better. :-D
--Don aka Ygor
PAD
Please stay!! I actually like Hulk again, this is how it should be. Recently with the long winded garbage we've been subjected to for too many years.
The only run worth any mention since you left has been Jenkins run, which actually did some interesting things with the ball that you left rolling. The only thing I really hated was the cutsie names he gave the grey Hulk (Joe- he was only Mr Fixit for a short time), and the Merged hulk (The Professor-mmmmmmmmmmm).
The PAD/Weeks team has the potential to be fantastic for a long run. Surely Marvel must have thoughts as to what must happen in June just so that they can maintain deadlines. If not then I can see a break in any potential run you may have.
Thing I would like to have cleared up if you get Hulk back are:
What happened to the Leader (really)?
What happend to Betty ?
Get rid of Doc Samsons crappy eye patch!!
Return to the classic stone logo, I like the present one but it lacks the class of the old one.
Bring back Mad man!
Ian
I say bring back ..."Wild Man", we know he gave the Maestro a run for his money, how about a little torcher on the Hulk?
Pad,
I enjoyed it on the strength of Lee and Tom's art. Granted you gave them some pretty cool things to draw, but there really wasn't much story there. Just set up. I guess with our new paradigm of decompressed stories and writing for the Trades, I shouldn't expect more. I trust you as an author, so I give you the latitude to develop this story, but I warn you; Don't make me angry, you wouldn't like me when I'm angry!
The only real weakness that I saw in this story was that it does not really stand on its own, even in terms of knowing what's happening page to page. In other words, it reads like the first chapter of a trade, not really answering questions like "what's the Hulk doing in the ocean?" and "who are these people?", because much of that context can be given later in the trade. For a monthly, I see this as a weakness because I'm afraid many people are going to pick it up and say, "I don't get it" and walk away. I bought a copy for school, so I'll see how my kids respond to it (they are much more like the typical comic fan than I am).
That said, I really enjoyed the issue. I thought the specifics of what happen with the shark at the beginning are unclear, but the gist of the scene comes through. The Hulk/Banner interaction is a welcome return, as is the Hulk's attitude and the limited jokes. (I think sometimes the jokes are too forced, but the one Daredevil reference was brief enough to still be witty.) Weeks isn't my favorite Hulk artist of all time, but his work is always well done and accessible.
I wonder about a few things, though. First, since when does the Hulk's body adapt to changing conditions (breathing fluid)? Second, did anyone else find themselves wondering why any of this was happening but then remembering, "This is based on The Tempest" and letting that answer the question? What would someone think if they were reading this without being a regular peterdavid.net reader? Third, how is Marvel looking at these numbers? Are they going to give the book a couple of months to gather steam, or are they only looking at 77? It seems to me that, since this was originally intended to be a mini-series, this story will not be representative of the type of story you would do on an extended run, PAD.
I am thrilled you're back on the book, but I worry that reader response will be lackluster for any number of reasons and that Marvel won't let you build a new following on this book. I really hope they do; I've been wondering for a long time what was going to happen with Cary St. Nord. (Did I get that name right?)
Good luck!
Eric
This issue was awsome! Its so great to have you back writing the Hulk. The artwork was incredible as well. I liked how you explained that Hulk could breath underwater now, it made sense. That was one thing I always liked, you always got around to explaining some of Hulks powers, like the superfast healing factor. Anyway, its great that you're back and hope you will stay for a long time!
So you CAN go home again. What the hell does Thomas Wolfe know? Nice work on your part, PAD, with an intriguing story. And nice work on Lee's part as well (although Tom Palmer makes anyone look good). All in all a solid issue. I'm in for #78.
I don't know if its been addressed. First, the Shark. I assumed it ran into the Hulk, the Hulk was Hungry, Ripped it in half and through the top half away. It was done for dramatic effect. You think the Shark is swimming really fast at you, but learn it has been ripped in half and thrown by the emerging hulk on the Ocean Floor.
As for the Mutated Squid. Hulk is by Monster Island..or Island X or whatever you wanna call it. Its an Island full of Monsters, thus the sea life near it is the first sign of whats instore for the HULK. Classic that Monster Island gets another addition to its family...THE HULK!
Uh..Threw not Through the top half. Sorry for the misuse of the word.
Oh..and I like the fact that it starts off in the ocean. It gives us a story and it gives us something to wonder about. I'm sure we will learn the answer. Not everything has to be laid out neat in front of us in the first issue. AS LONG AS ITS resolved by the last issue then thats what counts. ( Here that Identity Crisis!!)
Your return to Hulk was long overdue!!
I can remember reading your final issue on the book and thinking "there's no way he could top this!" Prove me wrong!!!!
Good news. My comics shop had it. I will read it and post my thoughts. In the mean time, PAD, would you please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please, please find time to do your Cowboy Pete Roundup, including the 2 hour return of Alias? Pretty please with a cherry on top?
Jim in Iowa
I haven't even read it yet, and I think it's great! I hope Peter's second run is longer than his first : )
(very happy Hulk/PAD fan)
it was wierd, the flashback was cool, and had atmosphere to spare. Me likey.
Oh, and I don't know if this'll add to your retailer woes, but I didn't see any copies of Hulk 77 on the shelves. He might have had 900 copies squared away on reserve, (he pulled my copy out of my weekly bag), but I don't know for sure.
Actually, I might as well just as ask it here.
Can I have an ancient suspicion confirmed?
Just before the Pantheon saga began Bruce merged his personality with that of the grey Hulk and the green Hulk to become one fused, merged not-quite-perfect Hulk-Bruce personality? The three-in-one dude was just that, removing Paul Jenkins' later retcons?
That was stated flat-out and I assume of course that it's true. The new Hulk's body was taller than the green Hulk (who was already taller than grey Hulk) and had more of grey's build? And he couldn't transform to Banner-form physically.
The biggest thing that I'd actually like to confirm is that when Bruce was split from the Hulk during the Onslaught thing was what we got a Hulk with the merged personalities of the green Hulk and grey Hulk? The body, of course, never changed.
When Banner returned and re-merged physically with this Hulk he didn't re-merge psychologically as well. He transformed from himself into that Hulk body.... and the Banner personality and the two-fused-in-one Hulk personality co-existed.
Did I read those comics right?
. I'm not new, I'm not flavor-of-the-month, and I'm not British,
Have you concidered getting a monocle and speaking with an accent?
Hope you don't mind a slighter longer comment. This is a review I've written up for an alternative newspaper which I write for. Thought it also might be appropriate to post it here. Please note that it's written for comic book virgins, which is why I explain stuff that obviously everyone here already knows. My headline for the piece is "Acclaimed writer's return to 'Hulk' is somewhat less than 'smashing' ":
If you’ve seen Ang Lee’s big-screen “Hulk” movie, you might have wondered why the director spent so much time developing the psychological relationship between the title monster and his alter-ego, Bruce Banner, when that time could seemingly have been better spent on additional “Hulk smash!” scenes.
It’s very likely because Lee was influenced in his portray of ol’ Jade Jaws by Peter David, who wrote “The Incredible Hulk” comic book for more than a decade and introduced many sophisticated, adult elements into a feature that was fairly juvenile and goofy prior to his arrival.
For example, David upped the Hulk’s intelligent quotient considerably so that he was no longer an innocent, monosyllabic creature but instead a crafting, conniving, rather unsettling character.
In addition, he introduced the idea that Bruce Banner suffers from Multiple Personality Disorder and played with it at considerable length, thus helping to explain why so many earlier interpretations of the Hulk were so radically different.
And, for good measure, David also brought a heaping factor of social relevance to the comic book.
For example, one of the Hulk’s longtime sidekicks had been a young black youth by the name of Jim Wilson. David brought Wilson back after many years in limbo and proceeded to reveal that he was HIV-positive, thus creating a powerful story in which all the Hulk’s strength isn’t enough to save his friend.
Unfortunately, many of David’s concepts–while perfect for the comic book medium–didn’t translate so well to the big screen. When considered as a comic book, however, David’s run was unquestionably the high point of the character’s 40-year history.
But roughly five years ago, David was abruptly ousted as Hulk writer by management weasels at Marvel Comics who apparently felt that the book’s dwindling sales (more reflective of the industry as a whole than that title specifically) could be improved by adding some “fresh blood” to the mix.
And so David was replaced by writer Bruce Jones, who, obviously inspired by “The X-Files,” turned the title into a conspiracy book in which the Hulk himself rarely appeared. The problem is–much like latter seasons of “The X-Files” itself–Jones’ story made no fucking sense!
Although Jones’ approach garnered some exciting buzz in the beginning, mainly because it was so different from what had come before, it fairly quickly began losing steam. By the time he was eventually through, even most of Jones’ early supporters had pretty much had enough.
Which is why so much anticipation was generated when Marvel recently announced that it was bringing David back to the title he is most closely associated with. His first issue, “Incredible Hulk #77,” hit comic book stands last week.
And it is, alas, a bit of a disappointment.
For one thing, David’s clever, sparkling, pun-filled dialogue is nowhere in evidence in this issue. Instead, he opts for a sparse, almost dialogue-free effect which really doesn’t play to his strengths as a writer.
David also attempts to focus the issue around the major “revelation” that the Hulk, because radiation is constantly changing his body chemistry, is now able to breath underwater. Somehow, though, this “revelation” manages to come off as more silly than intriguing.
All is not lost, however. The drawings, supplied by the talented Lee Weeks, are big, bold and impressive. Although Weeks’ artwork is not enough, by itself, to make up for the issue’s story shortfalls, it certainly comes close.
Furthermore, David ends the issue (part one of a five-part story) on enough of an intriguing cliffhanger to make me want to come back next month and see how it all plays out.
So, in the final analysis, this is in no way the triumphant return that MacArthur made to the Phillipines, but nor is it anywhere near the mess that George Lucas made of his last two “Star Wars” flicks.
While Thomas Wolfe might be correct in stating that “you can’t go home again,” I still have faith that Peter David might be able to come back for one hell of an extended visit.
Yipiiehh. Got my two copies of Hulk over in Germany today! I love it and will keep on buying the next issues... Enough of this 'i am on the run and can't get rest'-stuff.
"As for Betty... I think the Leader, who was supposedly "Dead" twice over, was revealed to have ressurected Betty, but also gave her plastic surgery so she looks like the actress who played her in the movie..."
I personally think she's an android or an imposter who had Betty's memories implanted into her by the Leader, who got ahold of them during that period of time when Betty was his hostage. I don't buy the plastic surgery thing.
Uhm...Shortdawg? I'm not entirely sure if you're aware of this, or if you're just deliberately abridging Hulk history to keep things quick and succinct for the purpose of your article, but Peter David wasn't replaced by Bruce Jones - he wouldn't take over writing chores on the title until much later. The person you're referring to is John Byrne.
Now, as for Hulk #77 - if the big guy, green OR gray, actually continues to appear for more than one panel per issue (the sound you just heard was Bruce Jones's head exploding), you won't hear any complaints from ME.
Having Peter David return to HULK is like having Clinton taking over the Oval Office again after George W.. Like Clinton, Peter had his fair share of detractors. But also like Clinton, after being compared to a subsequent successor, it's odd how detractors abruptly change their tune:
"For God's sake, Peter, have the Hulk struggling with a clogged toilet for an entire issue, for all we care! WELCOME BACK, MAN!!"
> Uhm...Shortdawg? I'm not entirely sure if you're aware of this, or if you're just deliberately abridging Hulk history to keep things quick and succinct for the purpose of your article, but Peter David wasn't replaced by Bruce Jones - he wouldn't take over writing chores on the title until much later. The person you're referring to is John Byrne.
Earlier still - it was actually Joe Casey. And it wasn't so much "fresh blood," as Marvel wanted a mute/Savage Hulk, PAD wanted to continue his story as planned, and thus...
Have you concidered getting a monocle and speaking with an accent?
Peter.
Listen to your fans.
They know what they're talking about.
Trust me, monacles are hip. Its gonna be the "in" fashion in 2005. Expect many stars to show up with monacles at the Oscars in Feb.
Do it. Now.
PAD,
Ok, I got my copy. I read it. I was confused. That is not necessarily a bad thing. In fact, I do know I will be picking up at least the next 5 issues to finish this series (and perhaps longer if you do stay on the title). But the shark thing just didn't work for me. That may be an artist thing (who overall did a great job), where he just didn't quite draw it the way you visualized it. But starting out having to r-read the first few pages 5 times does not get me off to a great start.
As a fan of Madrox, I did miss the dialog. But by the end, I realized I was applying wrong expectations. Hulk is not Madrox. The dialog was very appropriate. And it drew me in quite effectively.
If I had to give a score, it is an 8 out of 10. It was not the homerun out of the box like Madrox was for me, but then again, I was more of an X-Factor fan than a Hulk fan.
Bottom line, I have a lot of confidence that this is the first chapter. Previous posters seem to forget that, at least as I recall, this was originally conceived as being a 6 issue limited series. So it was not written as the "triumphal return" in one monthly issue. Nor was it written solely to be a monthly title collected as a trade. Knowing this, apart from just not getting the shark thing, I thought it was a great opening act and can't wait for the next chapter/act in the story.
I never got into the Hulk until the last 2 years or so of your run, and I dropped it with your last issue, so the fact that you have renewed my interest is a credit to your writing and not any inherent interest in the character. Unlike Iron Man which I seem to collect no matter who is writing it--I just think the character and suit are cool!--I only get the Hulk because of an interest in the stories you tell.
(Unlike the two hour Alias, which vastly disappointed me. Could you *PLEASE* do a Cowboy Pete so that I can vent? Pretty please???)
Jim in Iowa
Shortdawg... while Peter David did many fine things to the title, told great stories and good overal story arcs, as well as improving many features and aspects of the series, the guy who introduced the psychological elements to the Hulk series was Bill Mantlo.
Your alternative newspaper should issue a retraction.
Crediting Peter David for introducing the Multiple Personality aspect of the series (instead of improving it) is like like crediting Bill Mantlo for coming up with the idea of the Hulk rampaging and fighting aliens and smashing things.
It's like crediting Henry Ford for inventing the automobile or automobile production when he actually invented the automobile assembly line thus making automobile production better.
It's like crediting William F. Buckley for formulating and inspiring political Conservatism or Chris Claremont for creating Magneto.
We shouldn't forget or mock the great stuff that Peter David has created in and for the Hulk series, but at the same time we shouldn't piss on the foundation of all of that.
Bottom line, I have a lot of confidence that this is the first chapter.
Sorry, in my haste I did not proof my post. I obviously didn't complete my thought. Here is what I meant to say:
Bottom line, I have a lot of confidence that this is the first chapter of a great story.
Also, I meant to type "reread" not "r-read."
Jim in Iowa
Joe Casey...?
Ah! That's right! I was thinking along the lines of the "rebooted" series, and completely forgot about the post-David issues leading up to #474. Mah bad.
"Crediting Peter David for introducing the Multiple Personality aspect of the series (instead of improving it) is like like crediting Bill Mantlo for coming up with the idea of the Hulk rampaging and fighting aliens and smashing things."
Actually, of the things that are misreported in the piece, that's the closest to the truth.
It's a fine line, and I've never hesitated to inform/remind people that it was Bill (or possibly Barry Windsor-Smith, depending who you talk to) who introduced the history of Bruce's being abused as a child. Bill, however, never actually used the phrase "MPD" or established that more than one Hulk personality was rattling around in Bruce's skull at any given time. I did that. I basically looked at what had been written and realized that all the groundwork for MPD had been laid, but never actually explored.
PAD
Liked it. Scripting was clever, plot was interesting and the art was good.
My only complaint was it seemed a bit drawn out. When I got to the final scene, I felt as though I had only read half of a comic. Still, that "half" was impressive. I'll be back to check out the next one.
Shortdawg... while Peter David did many fine things to the title, told great stories and good overal story arcs, as well as improving many features and aspects of the series, the guy who introduced the psychological elements to the Hulk series was Bill Mantlo.
Your alternative newspaper should issue a retraction.
As PAD mentioned, yeah, Bill Mantlo was the main culprit, but his work, it can be argued, was plagiarized from an aborted Barry Windsor-Smith Hulk project...which is making its way to comics in an extended novel within the next few years. Heck, the stuff Mantlo expanded upon was really started by Roger Stern during his tenure on the book, which suggested the key to the Hulk's development lay deep in Banner's past--that the Hulk existed before the G-bomb. Check "The Monster's Analyst," in IH #227, and the issue previous, for some fun.
~Gary
Okay, was I the only one who thought that the giant squid looked like the Leader and the two-headed monster resembled Abomination?
So what did I think?
Well, this is the first issue of Hulk I ever purchased. EVER.
Unless you count that Giant-Sized Treasury Edition that I got at a garage sale when I was a wee kid that had Hulk travelling to Earth-2...
Anyway, I liked it. Which isn't to say I loved it. I guess I've been spoiled by Supergirl, New Frontier and Fallen Angel that I expected a little more right from the get-go.
However, what was here was intriguing. I will say, the Shark stuff didn't read very clearly to me the first time either. But some of that was because I missed the fish tail he was holding and the like.
I'm intrigued to see where it goes from here. The art was very cool - it almost reminded me a bit of Byrnes work at times, strangely... and the ending was a great way to keep me coming back for more. I'm all for it. Now if only I could find Issue 1 of Madrox so I could collect that series...
Peter -
It is certainly a pleasure to have you back with us. This title has lacked any sense of psychological drama, action, consistent characterisation and purpose over the past few years - it was very rewarding to see all of these elements in your very first issue! Most importantly, I was very excited to see you exploring Bruce's desire to be a 'hero' in this issue. Portraying the Hulk as a hero, however flawed, is central to the character and I sometimes feel that you have allowed your characters to spend too much time on the 'dark side' (eg Genis-Vell). Don't get me wrong, I like that you explore the darker sides of a character's personality. However, I also need to believe in the ultimate nobility of the Hulk and it was refreshing to see you starting to explore this aspect of Bruce's character.
I eagerly look forward to Part 2!
Regards,
Matt
Thought it was outstanding.
One of the things that made Peter's original Hulk run so remarkable was his ability and willingness to twist his entire status quo 90 degrees into an unexpected new direction every year or so. "Tempest Fugit" does it again: same character, new insights, new scenario, fresh entertainment.
And I don't understand what was so confusing about the shark. I thought it was very simple: [i]This big guy is one baaaaaad mutha.[/i]
Well, the buzz on the issue brought me back to my local comic store after an almost two year run.
So in a sense, that is good for the comic store owner and the comic industry and yet, bad for my bank account and wallet.
I hung out and talked with the owner for about 45 minutes: about wrestling, football, and most of all, comics. What I've been missing, what's good, what's decent. I picked up some of the Pfeifer (sp) run on Aquaman, Ultimates 2 #1, and of course, Hulk.
The Aquaman issues and storyline were rushed and absurd. Not quite sure why it was getting buzz.
Ultimates was solid.
Hulk...well, I wish I could just chalk up the lack of clarity, action, words, anything of substance to a first issue of an arc...but even with those excuses or explanations, the issue still falls short for me.
Which is a shame. I'm a big PAD fan, don't get me wrong. I've got the Apropos novels, I've got the King Arthur novels, the NF novels, the Aquamans, the Young Justices.
And even though I wanted to like this book, it was read in 20 seconds and what little words their were came off too silly to even be PAD.
The art? I'm wasn't a big fan. The two headed monster was just not very good.
I hate to be sounding so negative but that's what was going through my mind at the time. Everything just seemed too drawn out yet rushed and everything about the thing was average.
I haven't been much of a Hulk fan, I admit, but felt this would be something of a inspiration for me to get into the character. So far it hasn't yet.
Yeah, I'll check out the next issue, and yeah, I know I'm being negative. Chalk it up to higher expectations if you must, but honestly nothing in the book stood out for me.
God, I sound like a bitter critic who hates everything...what have I become?
It felt like an early Image comic to me. Mostly many pages with mostly fight scenes and very little dialogue, and two pages of some flashback backstory. I breezed through it in just minutes. I didn't understand what Hulk was doing underwater, what that weird octopus monster was, or in general, what was going on. The revelation of the breathing liquid his body produces was a surprise, though I'm not sure why nobody ever knew about it before. The most interesting part storywise was the last page.
The art was adequate, but not much else. With its simplified faces, heavy brushstrokes and overuse of hatching and other linework, it seemed like a cross of John Romita Jr. and Mike Deodato, neither of whose artwork I think is very good. I don't understand, for example, why the Hulk's right arm is in shadow on the last page, but his left arm isn't. Just what light source is producing this effect? It's unfortunate that the last adquate Hulk artist Peter worked was Adam Kubert, and the last really great one was Gary Frank (whose cover of What If...?, btw, was just beautiful).
Hopefully it'll get better.
Shortdawg: But roughly five years ago, David was abruptly ousted as Hulk writer by management weasels at Marvel Comics...
Luigi Novi: I thought Peter quit?
Oh, gods...I just remembered I have an Kubert drawn issue of the Hulk that is perhaps the worst artistically rendered book I have ever seen. I was horrified when I read it and I'm still in shock. Maybe I'll go find the issue number soon.
It's just so so bad.
Kubert's work can be great--when altered with jazzy coloring.
Peter,
While I did enjoy the issue, it was certainly paced somewhat differently than a lot of your past work, even to some extent Captain Marvel. Thank heavens for the scenes set in the past. I guess what I'm getting at is this: did marvel editorial force you to decompress? It had the same sort of feeling I got from Geoff Johns Avengers run, which is the only work of his I've ever seen that I didn't like.
That is, not a lot happened. Or at least what did happen could have easily happened in a lot less pages.
I think that's what the previous poster meant about being spoiled by Fallen Angel or Supergirl.
I did still enjoy it and I'm staying on board, but it just felt a heck of a lot like what it was, a better than average 2005 Marvel book.
Matt
"While I did enjoy the issue, it was certainly paced somewhat differently than a lot of your past work, even to some extent Captain Marvel. Thank heavens for the scenes set in the past. I guess what I'm getting at is this: did marvel editorial force you to decompress?"
You know...I have to say, I find this whole "Company mandated" compressed/decompressed discussion that pervades the net to be complete and total crap. It's not just you; it's everywhere I see it, and I think it's nonsense.
Anyone see "Amadeus?" The Emperor saying, "Too many notes,Mozart." And a stunned Mozart explaining that he uses exactly as many notes as he needs to tell the story, no more, no less.
I wanted to open the story with the Hulk on his way to the island, rather than just something boring like washing up or landing on it, which we've seen a million times.
I wanted to give Lee Weeks some room to strut his stuff, especially in response to fans who were dismissive of him when he was announced as the penciler.
I wanted to give the book a different feel than the way I was writing Hulk before, because for every fan who said, "Hurrah, PAD is back on the book" there was another who said, "But we know what to expect from him, so there will be no sense of discovery or surprise."
Since the island is the site of a five issue story arc, I wanted to give the Hulk at least one other venue in which to strut his stuff.
With all of that to consider, I wrote the first issue the way I did. Does everyone see how compression/decompression doesn't even begin to enter into it? Not a lot of dialogue? What could I possibly have added to the first pages that would have improved upon it?
Once upon a time we had writers, and readers, who were mostly influenced by books. So you'd get a Superman story where one panel would read: "CAPTION: And so Superman takes off, flying for a solid week through space to take him to the far off planet of Urgh. But as he approaches, he gets a most unexpected surprise." The art is Superman looking surprised as a squad of armed warriors is flying toward him. And Superman is thinking, "Great Krypton! An entire hoard of flying men, ready to attack me!"
That's panel one. Panel two: "CAPTION: Moments later, after a brutal struggle, Superman realizes the futilit of fighting and allows himself to be brought before the planet's queen, Lura Loo, who unbeknownst to Superman must find a husband before sunset!" The art has Superman being dragged before her, and the queen is thinking, "Who is this handsome stranger? Could he be the one I've been waiting for?!"
And there's eight, nine of those panels on a page.
Anyone think that's better?
Like it or not, the quick cutting of MTV and the reduced attention span of the Sesame Street generation has changed the way storytelling in all forms of entertainment--film, TV, movie--is being told. So this singling out of comics is unfair, ridiculous and tiresome.
PAD
PAD,
I apologize since I seem to have mistaken a deliberate artistic decision for something that it wasn't. I should have known better, especially knowing what I know about your work.
That said, Marvel does have me jumping at shadows when it comes to this one. I don't think I'm making this up. I don't think that the idea that comics are being "written for the trade" is a myth in the least. I also think that it's appearing FAR more in comics, and in Marvel comics in particular.
Look at the number of six issue storylines that Marvel is putting out now compared to five years ago. This is at a time where Marvel is releasing more trade paperbacks than ever, and is aiming at a bookstore audience more than ever. I just ran through the solicitations for March and I found around 23 titles which were in the midst of a 6 issue storyline, though some were limited series. There were also a number of 5 issue storylines and I think one seven issue storyline.
Some writers do it very well. Mr. Bendis generally is one. I think that the writers of New X-Men: Academy X deal with the format very well. JMS said recently that his FF run is going to be made up of a number of 6-issue storylines, and that he's looking forward to the added detail that format offers him. Joss Whedon's Astonishing X-Men has managed it fairly well also. Brian K Vaughan seems to be doing well with it too.
Some writers tend to fare somewhat less well. The example I used above was Geoff Johns, one of my favorite comic writers, and how drawn out his Red Zone storyline felt. I think Chuck Austen's X-Men run would have been far less painful if arcs like the Draco didn't run six issues.
I understand why you'd be upset. I apologize for insinuating something in your writing that obviously wasn't there. Past forums such as this, I freely admit that I have no direct access to what's going on in the minds of the writers and the editors, and all I can do is tell you my observations from reading comics most of my life, and what those obeservations tell me is that Marvel is encouraging its writers to write extended 6-issue arcs, often to the detriment of a story which might have been shorter five years ago. It's not something that I've noticed in other forms of media to bother me as much as in comics.
I'm so used to seeing and feeling that sort of decompression, or I suppose, to be fair, what I think to be that sort of decompression that I saw it almost as a reflex in the first issue of your Hulk run, and again, I apologize for that. I'll try to be a little more disconcerting in the future.
Matt
PS. For the record, your run on Supergirl might have my favorite pacing ever in a comic, but I've already taken enough of your time, so I won't babble on about that.
Mssr. David,
I agree with that Qel-Droma cat -- I was not very impressed. I have ever single issue of your last run (started at the "merge" and worked my way around to get it all).
I understand your point on "using all the notes you think you need" to tell the story. The flaw, then, may be in the story, not in your application of craft. I don't know yet -- I have one issue, which I found underwhelming (my fault for having hopes).
In my writing workshop, one time I was asked about a story point, and I proceeded to explain what I meant. The questioner waited for me to be done and asked, "why isn't any of that in the piece?" I was stuck. If a piece of writing misses its intended target, that's a mis-step in either concept or craft.
Which is not to take anything away from your considerable talent, or my years of enjoying your work (I did stick with Fallen Angel as you suggested, and I did like it better).
Your mileage, as always, may vary. Best.
-H
As unintentionally funny as it might be, I meant to say discerning and not disconcerting at the end there. My fingers move faster than my brain. Sorry.
I had a feeling if enough people echoed those sentiments that it would raise your ire.
The thing is though, it's not just a quick cutting and attention span thing, though I must admit, it's tempting to chalk it up to.
It's actually a "what we got wasn't very good" thing. Yes, it's the beginning of an arc. Yes, it was slow on purpose. Yes, I personally GOT what you were doing...I just didn't like it.
I wasn't into the art so I wanted the writing to distract me. It didn't. It just wasn't sparse dialogue...but what was there wasn't good. Talking about his lungs was silly and you know it.
I can also see why the shark thing was confusing. I saw what was going on but I did have to re-read it after the panel where Hulk is walking and there is seemingly no shark in his hand and the next he is holding up the bottom half and it's not clear that it's actually ripped apart. That's more an artistic problem.
It just went too fast and we walked away with nothing. I have no clue what Monster Isle is, and maybe that's my fault...but I'm a new reader so help me out.
Honestly, for me, I just didn't like the story of Hulk walking in the water, passing out, and continued next time. Perhaps I was looking for a side plotline that didn't come, who knows.
You ask "What'ja think" and we tell you. You know yourself the issue wasn't anything great and it was average as can be. I know you don't believe all the gushing. Maybe I, and Matt D is the minority here but we had something to say because you asked.
In the grand scheme of the arc, I doubt it will matter, that's because you are a solid writer, in fact my favorite at this point in my life. But as of right now, this first issue wasn't interesting and the art couldn't carry it.
Since my sabbatical from comics I've continued to read tons of novels. Sometimes 600 pages. I don't watch TV much and so I do suffer from the quick cut syndrome. I just didn't like the issue.
I will buy your next one, that's for sure, and I still drop your name at every oppurtunity. (Apropos Book One was a gift I gave this Christmas).
Maybe it's wrong of anyone to assume that this arc is written for the upcoming trade...it honestly didn't cross my mind since I don't read them. But can you really blame anyone for that jaded way of thinking?
1Just figured I'd say that I really enjoyed this issue. I've never been into Hulk but I liked the issue and I'll be on for reading it as long as you are on. I'll also give some props to Matt Adler for reccomending the book.
"It's actually a "what we got wasn't very good" thing. Yes, it's the beginning of an arc. Yes, it was slow on purpose. Yes, I personally GOT what you were doing...I just didn't like it."
And I've got no problem with that. I've been doing this for twenty years, and in all that time, never--NEVER--have I produced a work that absolutely, positively everyone who read it said they liked.
To me, the number of people who said they loved it is staggeringly gratifying. I was fully prepared, since the comic was SO different from everything else I've done, to have the vast majority of people echo your sentiments. I felt as if fans would essentially be saying, "This first issue better measure up to the best of the best of twelve years worth of stories or I'm outta here." And what could I write that could possibly meet those sorts of expectations?
I just wanted to make it clear that, in broad strokes, I think comics are getting something of an unfair rap considering the stylistic sea change we see in so many forms of storytelling these days.
PAD
Yes, like any good biopic, I did compress history a bit just to simplify things for the uninformed and make things flow better dramatically. Thus ignoring Bill Mantlo's own psychological complexities and the various other writers between PAD and Jones. Still, while the facts might be slightly fudged, I think "the truth" remains undisputed.
What is the problem with the Bl**dy Shark? Hulk ripped it in half-end of story, move on.
I was really impressed with the issue purely because it is the most panels Hulk has appeared on in his own book for YEARS!!!
MORE PLEASE!
People mentioning Bill Mantlo above, what happened to him anyway. The last issue I can find with his name on it was Marvel Fanfare#47 (I think that was the number). I asked the question several years ago in Comics international but nobody could answer it.
The artist I would like to draw Hulk-given the choice would be Ivan Reis who drew a mean Hulk in the Order.
Ian
People mentioning Bill Mantlo above, what happened to him anyway. The last issue I can find with his name on it was Marvel Fanfare#47 (I think that was the number). I asked the question several years ago in Comics international but nobody could answer it.
As I understand it from Tony Isabella's blogs, columns and posts to racmu, (those interested can search out the particulars on their own) Mr. Mantlo was the victim of an (automobile?) accident a few years ago- the effects of which have robbed him of much of his capacity for writing, communicating or much in the way of memory, poor soul. I miss his writing very much myself. His run on "Micronauts" is one of my great childhood memories and was the first book I ever collected from start to finish.
I've just read on a Hulk web site that you are on record as saying you are on Hulk at least 'til the end of the year with an Abomination mini series as well? Is this true?
http://www.incrediblehulk.com/hulkcomicnews.html
Check it out!
Ian
Now that you mention about Bill Mantlos' accident, I think I vaguely remember it having been written on a Bull pen bulletins page at some point. A poor shame, I say a Hulk legends one shot should be printed to mark this oft forgotten Hulk writer. Petitions to The big Q at Marvel now!
Ian
Well, I've gotta agree that it certainly was different than I expected (not that I mean that in a bad way...) I, for one, had no problem with the long monologue about Hulk's lungs. It made perfect sense to me that as Hulk changed back into Banner that a type of stream-of-conscousness rambling would occur, especially considering that both of them were exhausted. I also understood the shark bit immediately, so people's confusion there is a bit puzzling to me.
All of that said, I'm actually gonna reserve judgement until I read a bit more. It's kinda like reading the first ten pages of a novel and thinking you know whether it's going to be the best thing ever; it just can't be done. This is the first chapter, let's see where it goes.
Oh, and on a personal level, I find it incredibly poetic that Peter's Hulk returns to my life just around the time where some personal circumstances are bringing my own Hulk out in me. Let's hope that I can deal with it as well as Bruce does...
Mr. Peter David,
HULK #77 was a fascinating read. It has an odd, intense atmosphere of mystery, and dread, which I haven't seen in your entire previous 12-year body of work on THE INCREDIBLE HULK. Thank you for giving the Hulk a more substantial role in HIS OWN TITLE, as opposed to having him walk with a bunch of white poodles across one panel. Or appearing outside of a bank wearing a cowboy hat.
I'm a little confused about all the obsession that's been directed at the ripped-apart SHARK, of all things. I've gradually noticed a strange, recurring symptom in fans over the years: they home in and fixate on one particular aspect of a comic/movie, and refuse to let it go over an extended period of time, in the process negating everything else - including the story as a whole. In Sam Raimi's SPIDER-MAN, it was the organic webshooters. In Ang Lee's HULK, it was the Hulk dogs.
I'm not jumping to conclusions until I've actually SEEN the conclusion of TEMPEST FUGIT. (Maybe I should re-read William Shakespeare's text for clues to the possible outcome...?) In the meantime, BRAVO!
Mr. David,
Something else I forgot to mention. I especially liked the scene where the Hulk reverts back to Banner for the first time in the issue. The Hulk begins to talk like Banner, and then Banner for thr first few moments after his transformation speaks like the Hulk. A good example of how the two personalities "bleed" into one another sometimes without either being aware of it.
I liked it, for the most part. Only part that I didn't quite like (apart from the Hulk outside of Banner at the end, but I assume this will be explained) is the retcon of Hulk not being able to breathe underwater.
I am not a big fan of giving Hulk more powers than he already has, which is quite a lot. I always liked the fact that Hulk *could* be killed by drowning or being placed in outerspace long enough. I liked the fact that for all his strength, speed, and regeneration, he was still after all limited by a humanoid body just like the rest of us. He can't fly, he has to breathe, he has to eat.
Adding another power like that only makes it harder for someone like me to connect with the human-like aspect of Hulk as well as putting him one step closer to Invinciboy, Superman. You retconned the "Skin can't be penetrated by Adamantium" which I accepted, for it was a change that came with a balance. Breathing underwater like Namor though? Harder for me to accept.
Peter David: I wanted to give Lee Weeks some room to strut his stuff, especially in response to fans who were dismissive of him when he was announced as the penciler.
Luigi Novi: Well if they were dismissive of him because they don’t think he’s that good, I don’t see how giving him more room would alleviate that.
Peter David: Like it or not, the quick cutting of MTV and the reduced attention span of the Sesame Street generation has changed the way storytelling in all forms of entertainment--film, TV, movie--is being told. So this singling out of comics is unfair, ridiculous and tiresome.
Luigi Novi: I don’t think anyone is singling out comics. They’re singling out your work because they’ve come to expect certain things from you. The MTV-ization of entertainment is something you’ve been mentioning for well over a decade, and you’ve always managed to defy that trend in your own work, so it’s surprising to see it suddenly show up in an issue of a book of yours that I was looking forward to.
Tom: Talking about his lungs was silly and you know it.
Luigi Novi: No, he doesn’t “know” it. You merely opined it.
Shortdawg: Yes, like any good biopic, I did compress history a bit just to simplify things for the uninformed and make things flow better dramatically. Thus ignoring Bill Mantlo's own psychological complexities and the various other writers between PAD and Jones. Still, while the facts might be slightly fudged, I think "the truth" remains undisputed.
Luigi Novi: Wow, I had no idea Oliver Stone was a visitor to this site.
Jomero: Only part that I didn't quite like (apart from the Hulk outside of Banner at the end, but I assume this will be explained) is the retcon of Hulk not being able to breathe underwater.
Luigi Novi: The premise is that he was able to breathe under water, but that he didn’t know it.
Jomero: You retconned the "Skin can't be penetrated by Adamantium"…
Luigi Novi: When did he do this? In Hulk #340, Wolverine did penetrate the gray Hulk’s skin. It was speculated in Wolverine Saga that the reason Wolvie couldn’t do so with the green Hulk in their first encounter was because the green Hulk’s skin was much tougher, and Wolverine simply didn’t possess the strength to drive the claws into it.
Glad to see you back on the Hulk!
I was a big fan of your work in the 90s. Just hearing that you were going to come back and work on the book made me re-read all the Hulk issues I have in my collection (around 100 or so).
The Hulk can breathe under water? I'm not sure why that would be. I remember in The End that the Hulk survived a nuclear holocaust so I guess his body could adapt to anything. At first I thought it was strange, then I thought it was funny, then I called all of my fellow Hulk fan friends and bragged at the new information that I just picked up.
Man, it's been AGES since I've picked up the Hulk (I stopped reading it when the Hulk was still involved with the Pantheon and the Troyjan war was about to start). I'm wondering if he still says "Hulk Smash."
Don't make mine marvel... make mine David! That doesn't sound right... make mine a rum and coke
-CCR
Jomero: Only part that I didn't quite like (apart from the Hulk outside of Banner at the end, but I assume this will be explained) is the retcon of Hulk not being able to breathe underwater.
Luigi Novi: The premise is that he was able to breathe under water, but that he didn’t know it.
I enjoyed the story as well as this twist. It is still a retcon because the Hulk has lost consciousness due to exposure to gases and water in times past. Heck, Batman defeated him with gas by getting him to stop holding his breath and inhaling the bat-gas deeply. See, now you've done it..... you actually made me type out bat-gas. ;)
Fred
I'm a little confused about all the obsession that's been directed at the ripped-apart SHARK, of all things. I've gradually noticed a strange, recurring symptom in fans over the years: they home in and fixate on one particular aspect of a comic/movie, and refuse to let it go over an extended period of time, in the process negating everything else - including the story as a whole. In Sam Raimi's SPIDER-MAN, it was the organic webshooters. In Ang Lee's HULK, it was the Hulk dogs.
You are comparing apples to oranges. I did not obsess that PAD had Hulk rip a shark in half. I commented that I had to flip the pages back and forth 5 times before I *understood* that was happening. I am not commenting on the content of the story, but on the delivery and clarity of what was trying to be communicated. I think that may be what others were commenting on as well. And when it is the opening act of a book, it does have an impact. First impressions do count even in writing.
In regards to the "breathing under water" issue, I am curious. I need to reread the comic book again. I was not sure, but my first impression was that the Hulk adapted to the pressure of the water, and was not truly breathing. In essence, he was not converting water into oxygen, but his body had adapted so that he would not suffer the bends. I could be wrong, but that was what PAD was saying. I also was not sure that this has always been the case. I got the impression that this may have been a new "mutation" of his powers. If true, then it does not change what has happened in the past. (Of course, if my idea was right, the Hulk was holding his breath for a very long time!)
Jim in Iowa
Finally got a chance to read it (no new comics for three weeks because of vacation).
All in all not bad. The ad art turned me off to the title. But when I had a chance to see it in the book, I felt it fit and enjoyed it.
While I didn't care for the Hulk breathing underwater aspect, it's a minor thing.
I will definitely be checking out the next issue.
KIP
[quote]PAD: "Like it or not, the quick cutting of MTV and the reduced attention span of the Sesame Street generation has changed the way storytelling in all forms of entertainment--film, TV, movie--is being told. So this singling out of comics is unfair, ridiculous and tiresome."[/quote]
While I see your point (in the Superman example) on the dialogue matching the captions matching the pictures, I don't understand how "decompressed storytelling" is supposed to appeal to the MTV generation. Wouldn't it make more sense to appeal to the MTV folks with the "uncompressed storytelling" of the Superman example?
If you want to appeal to people with short attention spans, how does taking your time with a given scene succeed in doing that?
Or am I misunderstanding the point?
You're right that all forms of entertainment are changing, but it seems like most formats are speeding up. Comics on the other hand are slowing down.
Just skimmed throught the comments. The shark thing confused people? It seemed like a bit of clever misdirection on the first page (where it looks like the shark is swimming) but becomes very clear once the shark begins to drop. I thought it was cleverly done and gorgeously rendered, and ultimately clear. The best scene in the issue, IMO.
Rob S.
I really liked the issue!
First Hulk comic I've liked in years. Loved the bit with the shark. And the ending was pretty damn good as a cliffhanger for the next issue.
As a spokesmen for SAAPIM (Sharks Against Aggressive Portrayal in Media), I don't think I have to tell you, Mr. David, how insulted and outraged we are at your newest comic.
Why, if I were half the shark as the one portrayed in your comic...
What? What? Why is everyone laughing?
A. Shark:
>As a spokesmen for SAAPIM (Sharks Against Aggressive Portrayal in Media), I don't think I have to tell you, Mr. David, how insulted and outraged we are at your newest comic.
>Why, if I were half the shark as the one portrayed in your comic...
>What? What? Why is everyone laughing?
We're not laughing. That joke bites. :p
~fin~
Fred
Cool -- so a feature character down the line is Hammerhead, then?
Sorry. Feel free to beat me and I'll go home to nurse my wounds...
TWL
I really enjoyed the issue, both the writing and the artwork. And I certainly like where it's going - when I saw the two-headed creature, I thought "Wow, is this Monster Island?" (I mainly know it from Godzilla films rather than Marvel comics, but the concept is still cool.)
One question - like many people (I suspect), I've only read a few issues of Hulk since PAD finished his previous run on the title. Is there anything I/we need to know about what's happened in the meantime?
John C. Kirk:
>One question - like many people (I suspect), I've only read a few issues of Hulk since PAD finished his previous run on the title. Is there anything I/we need to know about what's happened in the meantime?
Nope. Most of the issues that have been presented in PAD's absence had little to nothing to do with the Hulk. The stuff before Jones had a few moments, but was otherwise very forgettable. Jones' writing had no resemblence to the Marvel monster or his universe.
Fred
Jim in Iowa,
I wasn't referring to you in particular, but nevertheless, you're correct. There was nothing at all obsessive in your previous post, and if you were merely criticizing the DELIVERY of the story, then I can see where you're coming from.
But..."5 times"? Uhm...I really am doing my best not to imply anything here, (I've been in enough 'net flame wars over the years to be emotionally exhausted to the point of a coma), but I got Peter David's (and Lee Weeks's) intention when I read that particular sequence for the first time.
I have the issue right in front of me here, and I'm breaking the first sequence down as I'm writing this: Open on underwater scene. Shark passes directly above us (the readers), and glides away from view. Mysterious burst of red is seen in the distance. Shark returns, seemingly coming right for us. Suddenly, shark careens to the right. We finally see that the shark's lower half has been savagely torn away. Upper half of shark crashes into the ocean bottom. The recognizable silhoutte of the Hulk appears in view. Next is the big "splash" image, revealing the Hulk holding the shark's lower half in his hand.
How, exactly, was this scene delivered in an unclear manner?
John C. Kirk,
"One question - like many people (I suspect) I've only read a few issues of the Hulk since PAD finished his previous run on the title. Is there anything I/we need to know about what's happened in the meantime?"
Well, here are some pretty significant developments that happened in the meantime:
1.) During Joe Casey's run (#468-474) it was revealed that the Abomination - not exposure to Bruce/the Hulk's radiation - killed Betty
2.) Casey's brief run also portrayed possibly the brightest, most self-assured, strongest and most confident Bruce Banner ever seen
3.) John Byrne's relaunch was just short of terrible, but there was a very cool Hulk/Wolverine throwdown in issue #8
4.) Paul Jenkins' run was far from great, but his apex was Hulk #25, where the Hulk not only proved his physical superiority by memorably knocking The Abomination's eye out
5.) But hit him harder than he ever could with his fists by making The Abomination, Emil Blonsky, realize that for all his power he had lost the love of his life, Nadia Blonsky
6.) During the much-maligned Bruce Jones run, the Hulk was guided by a "Mister Blue", who turned out to be.....Betty, somehow alive! Or is it?
7.) Bruce Banner, while believing Betty to be dead, slept with Nadia Blonsky. When The abomnation found out, he wasn't too happy.
8.) The Leader turned out to be the one "pulling the strings" during Jones' run, and...well, I'll let someone else describe his appearance.
9.) The Absorbing Man was discovered to have the ability to take over the minds of people in close proximity.
10.) In Jones' final issue, Nadia is accidentally killed. The Hulk takes his rage out on Doc Samson - who he holds responsible - nearly killing him before Betty stops him. A grief-stricken Betty, who had grown close to Nadia and is traumatized by the incredible beating Samson took, yells at the Hulk/Bruce to get out of all their lives, screaming that he destroys everyone and everything he comes in contact with. The Hulk/Bruce leaps away, visibly shaken and crying over the death of Nadia, what he's done to one of his closest allies and Betty's hatred of him at that moment.
So there HAVE been some things of note in the intervening years of PAD's run on the title, and it will be interesting to see how PAD will address these events/circumstances, if he indeed gets another long-term shot at the character.
As I understand it from Tony Isabella's blogs, columns and posts to racmu, (those interested can search out the particulars on their own) Mr. Mantlo was the victim of an (automobile?) accident a few years ago- the effects of which have robbed him of much of his capacity for writing, communicating or much in the way of memory, poor soul.
Actually, a car struck him while he was rollerblading. He spent a year in a coma and is currently institutionalized. His condition is similar to the lead character in "Memento"--he has trouble forming short-term memories.
Check http://home.hiwaay.net/~lkseitz/comics/Rom/comic/mantlo.shtml for more info.
~Gary
Well, I find all this decompression VS "old school" comics storytelling intersting. I'm about sick of the word "decompressed" as much as I am "disassembled" (partly because it never looks like it's spelled right when type it) and "lo-carb."
In any case, since many a creator and editor have denied a company-wide mandate, then I can only assume it's just a trend that writers are diving into because it really seems like readers are responding to it.
The thing is, not every story is well suited to this sort of storytelling. The problem is I feel that some writers are trying to shoe-horn stories that would work at one issue into six. Then it all becomes a pacing problem. You get those issues that feel like "nothing happens" and it feels like the writer is reiterating the same points and there's no sense of momentum.
Another problem is that a lot rests on the story to be GOOD. If I invest 6 months and $18 in one story it better be damn good. And far too often lately I've started to feel a bit jipped. My pull list is smaller now then it has been in years. Before, you could chalk your odd Uncanny X-men or Avengers story as just being bad and move on. But now you've spent so much money on it that there's a lot more riding on it.
Now, Hulk surprised me. Just because it was so very different from what I expected PAD to write, but not in a bad way.
In my mind, I felt I got my money's worth. It was the first issue of the story, and it actually did a lot in a few pages. Sure, I read it VERY quickly (well, except for the Shark bit where I was confused, but that was partly due to some sloppy reading on my part) but a lot actually happens.
It feels to be very much about tension and set-up. We see the Hulk's raw power, we are reminded of the psychological aspect of who Banner/Hulk is and their relationship, and through the ever-growing monstrosity of the creatures Hulk fights we are lead to Monster Isle.
The bit at the end left me significantly intrigued - who were these people? Who let the blind man have the flame thrower? And who is that other Hulk?
Now, I AM hoping that in the next issue we get more words and story. And I'm betting we will, because I trust Peter to pace a story well. The bad thing about too much of today's stories is that they don't pick and choose their focus well. Far too often pages are spent in an exchange that could have been covered (and much more effectively) in a few panels and then not enough time is spent on something more crucial. It happens all the time. The problem with having all talking or all "epic, cinematic action" is that the effect can be lost. It's all about contrast.
Now, if it doesn't turn out like that I'll complain with the rest of them. But it does seem to early to make that judgement yet.
A. Shark,
"As a spokesman for SAAPIM (Sharks Against Aggressive Portrayal in Media), I don't think I have to tell you, Mr. David, how insulted and outraged we are at your newest comic. Why, if I were half the shark as the one portrayed in your comic...
What? What? Why is everyone laughing."
Fred,
"We're not laughing. That joke bites."
While A. Shark's attempt at humor was hardly hilarious it was good-natured, and someone who recently typed
"See, now you've done it..you actually made me type out bat-gas."
is hardly in a position to tell someone else their humor "bites".
Tim Lynch,
"Cool - so a feature character down the line is Hammerhead, then? Sorry. Feel free to beat me and I'll go home to nurse my wounds..."
While there are times I would probably take you up on your offer, this is not one of them. That was actually amusing, Tim.
Hands up whos' fed up with people not getting the bit with the shark?- (the ayes have it).
Very sad to read about Bill Mantlo, A great writer with much to contribute to the Marvel universe. I personally would put him up there with Mark Gruenwald, such a shame he isn't remembered with the same fondness. I certainly wish Bill well.
On a different note: Hulk rematch against the Thunderbolts anybody? (the fact that it would have PAD writing Captain Marvel again aside).
The return of Rick Jones to the Hulk would be great. What ever happened to Janis?
Here is probably not the right place to put this but I will anyway, because it could be of interest to a lot of people. In the UK Panini are doing a comic called The Mighty world of Marvel. This is a reprint title which covers classic Marvel.
At present Hulk is being reprinted in recoloured form all the way from issue 117 and have presently reached 134. They look great and occasionally use the original covers recoloured. I don't think these have been done in recoloured form before.
Other strips include Frank Millers DareDevil, Sterankos' Nick Fury and Ditkos' Doctor Strange.
Anybody whos' interested should
E-mail: info@panini.co.uk
Website for subscriptions:http://www.panini.co.uk
Thought people would like to know.
Ian :)
I have to admit that I read that shark fight a couple of times to figure out what had happened. But I'm not convinced that it is a problem with the storytelling, or the art. I think there's a tendency to skim read art - mainly because we're used to the words doing all the storytelling for us. So when the pictures actually do start telling a story - rather than just looking pretty - we're not necessarily conditioned to read them correctly.
I could be wrong though. Guess I'm going to have to go back and reread the pages again. :)
Looks like you missed the gaff there, Jerome. They really gilled you there!
However, I think I might be willing to give them both a fin to quit jawing...
Oh, I don't mind the bites, Jerome. I'm not that shellfish. It appears that Fred had a pacific porpoise in poking fin at me.
Ahh, if only Peter had known when he wrote the Shark in to the story that it would be a bigger talking point than the Hulk himself
Ian
A. Shark:
>It appears that Fred had a pacific porpoise in poking fin at me.
Good to see that you aren't being crabby halibut. *If that line didn't hook you, than I'm sunk.*
Welcome back to the book that is you. Looking forward to seeing what you will do for the Green Goliath this year.
Ugh, why is everyone going on and on about this shark thing? What was so hard to understand? We see the shark swimming underwater, most likely in search of food since that pretty much all they do is eat and swimm. Shark is swimming away from us and then off in the distance there is some sort of commotion, looks like the shark just chewed up a fish. The shark is now swimming toward us, no wait he is falling to the ocean floor. What could possibly have happened to the most feared predator in the oceans? He met up to the most feared predator on the planet, the Hulk. So the shark attacked the Hulk and the Hulk ripped it in half and threw the bitey part away. What was so confusing to understand? If you actually take your time and read and look at everything that is going on and not skim through everything so quickly there really wouldn't be a problem I think. I know we were all excited about PAD being back with the Hulk and we just want to devour the story and get to the end to see what happens but I think some of us have to slow way down and try and savour the issue because PAD is BACK! Who knows how long he will be here for, hopefully a long time, so lets try and enjoy it and not rush things :)
Loved the Weeks/Palmer Hulk(s). Loved the byplay between Classroom Bruce & the Hulk. Not sure where the storyline is going, but that's part of the fun, is it not? Let's put it this way: This is the first issue of IH I've picked up in a couple of years, but it won't be the last.
I for one was not disappointed in the issue. I didn't think it was the best comic I ever read, but certainly better than a lot of what's out there. I don't think I'm overstating things when I say that Mr. David shows why he's considered by so many to be the definitive Hulk writer.
Thanks to all, by the way, for clearing up the Betty's death question and what's up with the Banner's personalities since PAD left (and before he left... I have very few PAD issues after Onslaught). I've only read Hulk in back-issue form, and I haven't picked up any since PAD's departure, so I was curious.
The issue of "decompression" didn't occur to me having read this. I took it for what it seems to have been - the first chapter in a longer arc. If things don't pick up a little, then it might be time to cry foul over pacing issues. Heck, under many writers, this issue may have covered nothing other than Hulk's fight with the shark, so let's not take it for granted.
I'm intrigued about where this story is going, and what new developments and revelations will be made about Bruce Banner's psyche. I wish you luck, PAD, and hope that this run will turn into something longer.
As much as I liked Bruce Jones' (no relation) work on The Hulk, #77's ending made me stand up and yell "AND?" Great return to the book!!!
But..."5 times"? Uhm...I really am doing my best not to imply anything here, (I've been in enough 'net flame wars over the years to be emotionally exhausted to the point of a coma), but I got Peter David's (and Lee Weeks's) intention when I read that particular sequence for the first time.
Well, I do admit it was at the end of a long day, so I was tired. :-)
I have the issue right in front of me here, and I'm breaking the first sequence down as I'm writing this: Open on underwater scene. Shark passes directly above us (the readers), and glides away from view. Mysterious burst of red is seen in the distance. Shark returns, seemingly coming right for us. Suddenly, shark careens to the right. We finally see that the shark's lower half has been savagely torn away. Upper half of shark crashes into the ocean bottom. The recognizable silhoutte of the Hulk appears in view. Next is the big "splash" image, revealing the Hulk holding the shark's lower half in his hand.
Two reasons it took 5 times:
1.) I did not see a "mysterious burst of red." I saw a dark cloud. Did the Hulk just "jump/fall" into the water? It was unclear to me.
2.) I did not read the whole book far enough. I just went a few pages. I "got" what happened in that I saw the Hulk with half a shark. But the sequence in the comic didn't make sense. You can get the picture of what must have happened, but the pictures (for me, at least) seemed to not follow what one would assumed happened. I was left unsure whether the Hulk ripped the shark in half, or if he found it already ripped in half. As you go farther in the story, it makes sense that he must have done it. But it is not completely clear at the start.
Didn't ruin the comic for me, and I am fine with things being implied and not shown. But when the pictures leave open multiple possibilities, it is not as strong of a start as I would like.
Jim in Iowa
Hands up whos' fed up with people not getting the bit with the shark?- (the ayes have it).
Hey, PAD asked what we thought. If I was the only one who missed it, I would chalk it up to my being a little slow. But when a significant minority (if not more) expressed some confusion, I think it is worth noting. Any good communicator would want to know if something was not clear. At the end of the day, PAD it was written and drawn just as he intended, and that is fine. But I would be shocked if he was upset that we brought it up. (And while it has come up a number of times, it has not been the major source of comments.)
Jim in Iowa
Ok, so now I am not clear. Got to slow down and proof my posts. Here is what I meant to say:
"At the end of the day, PAD may decide it was written and drawn just as he intended."
Jim in Iowa
Glad you found that amusing, Jerome, but I think (as others have pointed out) that you missed the pun in Fred's response as well. (That's the only reason I jumped in -- I try not to start pun cascades, but I'll gladly participate.)
Ah well. Better luck next time ... chum.
TWL
Okay, this is getting annoying.
The following is, verbatim, my script. This is what I wrote. This is what I intended. Any differences between what I wrote and what was on the page, don't give me grief over them.
PAGE 1
PANEL A: The following panel sequential, until I indicate otherwise, are shot entirely from the same straight-on angle. We don’t waver from it. We are undersea, staring straight at the flat plain of an ocean bed. Schools of small fish are milling around in f.g. In b.g., it’s kind of murky, which makes sense since we’re reasonably far down and the only light is coming from bio-luminiscence.
PANEL B: Suddenly the fish frantically swim off in opposite directions. We have no idea what’s caused them to panic.
PANEL C: And then we think we know: A monstrous, almost prehistoric looking shark—something that looks like it may have wandered in on its way to Jurassic Park—barrels straight through. Essentially it’s heading away from our POV as it hurtles straight through the area that the fish had been in.
PANEL D: Then the shark is gone, into the murk.
PAGE 2
PANEL A: For a long moment, nothing moves.
PANEL B: Suddenly, from within the murk, there is an explosion of red. It would seem that the shark has discovered something and savaged it.
PANEL C: More red, and now most of the water is filled with it, and we see the vague outline of the shark heading toward us.
PANEL D: The shark hurtles right at us. Its mouth is open, huge, frightening, displaying vicious rows of teeth. There is some dark tint on the edges of the teeth, as if it sank those devastating weapons into something with almost brackish blood. The dorsal fin, however, is not in evidence, which is weird because you’d think it would be visible.
PAGE 3
PANEL A: And suddenly the shark is no longer heading toward us. Instead its head seems to be going off at an odd angle.
PANEL B: It angles away from us in the water and we come to the realization that only the front part of the shark was actually heading at us. This thing is stone cold dead. It’s entire back half is gone, and not cleanly. Something has literally torn the shark in half.
PANEL C: Nothing happens for a long moment except the red haze of blood hanging in the water.
PANEL D: And then, from the haze of red, we see the shadow of a massive form coming right toward us.
PAGES 4 TO 5
Double paged splash: The Hulk emerges from the red haze. He has a grim, determined smile. In his left hand, he’s carrying the back half of the shark’s carcass. He’s gripping it by the fin as if he were toting luggage.
OAD
I'm on vacation and bought 3 copies (1 for myself and 2 as gifts for friends who might continue reading the book)at a comic book store here and the guy said to me "you must know something I don't" Obviously he didn't know so I had to enlighten him
PAD,
First, thanks for posting the script for the first few panels. I enjoy seeing what happens "behind the scenes."
Second, while I didn't get it (at least at first), I do appreciate your using pictures to tell the story and not just using dialog (as in your "Superman" example earlier). That is why I buy comics and not just novels. I appreciate the talent it takes to tell the story visually. I enjoy the variety it brings to how a story is told.
Finally, I aplogize if my comments in particular were annoying. If I had asked for feedback, I would want to know that this had been an issue, so I shared my thoughts. I don't fault you or the artist, I was simply letting you know that I got confused.
I am here for the Hulk as long as you are writing it.
Jim in Iowa
PAD,
One comment: For some reason, my copy at least did not show "red." It was more of a blackish or grey color. So I did not think of blood but of just the bottom of the ocean being stirred up. The end result can still be the same, but if I had seen red, I would have immediately thought of an attack versus just a disturbance.
As far as I know, I am not color blind, but given my political leanings, you might disagree. :-)
Jim in Iowa
Actually, having the blood be blackish makes a lot of sense.
(Physics pedant mode ON)
Water absorbs red light preferentially, which is why by the time you're 50-100 feet down it's all shades of blue and green. (It's also why a tank full of water will tend to look a little greenish if you look through it at something.)
Lots of sea creatures at depth look black, but if you bring them up to the surface it turns out some are red or pink. There was no evolutionary pressure to keep the reds from reproducing, so they did.
At any rate, at the depths we're talking about anything red really WILL look black. If Weeks thought of that and chose accordingly, more power to him.
(Physics pedant mote OFF)
Of course, I got the point of the scene pretty quickly, so I'm perhaps not the best judge. :-)
TWL
Actually, having the blood be blackish makes a lot of sense.
I agree, Tim. The "explosion" of blackish whatever clearly is not on the ocean floor, so it does make sense now. It just went over my head. A "blood red" color would probably have been out of place. I just never thought of it as blood for some reason. I just assumed it was a "disturbance" in the water. I just don't like that I missed it because I am normally the one who gets it and can explain it to everyone else who doesn't.
Jim in Iowa
I've never noticed Lee Weeks' art before, but I thought this issue of Hulk was beautiful.
AND, the story (as written in your script) came across perfectly clearly to me. I was surprised to see the shark's back end missing, and got a little shock and a little sadistic laugh out of seeing the hulk a couple panels later.
Cool stuff.
PAD,
Thank you for allowing such a forum for feedback to exist. It brings the reader much closer to the creative process and who would have thought something like this could exist when I was a kid reading comics for the first time?
I'm not going to comment on the first issue as it was just the first part of a continuing story. I will continue to read and participate from time to time.
Thanks,
MM
"At any rate, at the depths we're talking about anything red really WILL look black"
Yeah, Tim, I know that. But since I felt my choices were (a) be scientifically accurate at the risk of confusing readers, (b) go with standard red so fans would say, "Oh...blood, or (c) show the Hulk grossly ripping the shark apart, I opted for (b). Considering that the coloring wound up being scientificallly accurate and some people are so bewildered over what happened that I actually had to post the damned script, I'm going to say that my reservations were well founded and I wish it had been colored the way I specified.
PAD
Oh, that wasn't intended as a criticism -- just a comment for those who found the black confusing. I agree that it looked rather blackish in the finished art, but I think most people followed it just fine anyway.
(I wouldn't have had an objection to red either, BTW -- there are major science errors and then there are stretches to make a point, and this would clearly have been the latter.)
TWL
The funny thing for me is, I had no problem with the shark on pages 2-3. I actually had a brain fart with page one: I didn’t understand that panel 2 on page 1 was the shark right over us. Because the page border is black, the shape blended in, and I read it as part of the background. I had to read the sequence twice to realize what happened. Silly me.
Jim in Iowa: I did not see a "mysterious burst of red." I saw a dark cloud. Did the Hulk just "jump/fall" into the water? It was unclear to me.
Luigi Novi: That think doesn’t look anything like a cloud to me, as it’s exploding outward. And how can if be a cloud if you think it may be the Hulk jumping or falling in the water? Indeed, how could him falling into the water produce that shape? Wouldn’t it be a shaft of displaced water/air bubbles going from top to bottom if he were landing in the water, given that we, the camera eye, is underwater too? I agree, however, that it isn’t red. It’s clearly light brown.
Peter David: PAGE 1 PANEL A: The following panel sequential, until I indicate otherwise, are shot entirely from the same straight-on angle. We don’t waver from it. We are undersea, staring straight at the flat plain of an ocean bed. Schools of small fish are milling around in f.g. In b.g., it’s kind of murky, which makes sense since we’re reasonably far down and the only light is coming from bio-luminiscence.
Luigi Novi: The FX people must not have read the script, because they put shafts of light coming from the surface in this scene. :-)
Peter David: The dorsal fin, however, is not in evidence, which is weird because you’d think it would be visible.
Luigi Novi: Weeks drew the dorsal fin in.
Tim Lynch: Actually, having the blood be blackish makes a lot of sense…Water absorbs red light preferentially, which is why by the time you're 50-100 feet down it's all shades of blue and green. (It's also why a tank full of water will tend to look a little greenish if you look through it at something.) Lots of sea creatures at depth look black, but if you bring them up to the surface it turns out some are red or pink. There was no evolutionary pressure to keep the reds from reproducing, so they did. At any rate, at the depths we're talking about anything red really WILL look black. If Weeks thought of that and chose accordingly, more power to him.
Luigi Novi: Applying this consistently, the entire scene would’ve been in black. :-)
"Oh, that wasn't intended as a criticism -- just a comment for those who found the black confusing."
Nor was I taking it as criticism, but merely observation. The thing is, I usually try to take pains to get things right when portraying real-world aspects of things. So it's ironic that this was an instance where I made a deliberate choice to have it be wrong to avoid confusion...and it wound up being right and, for some, confusing.
PAD
I thought the issue was a good set-up issue, the catch being I'm not a fan of set-up issues but I do understand their necessity. To this day I think Supergirl #1 is the best set-up issue I have ever read.
I am very excited for the rest of the story-line, and in general think the next year will be awesome.
PAD: I know the preoccupation here seems to be all about the shark, but I don't think the various Internet forums accurately represent the majority of readers.
The only item that gave me pause, was learning that nothing of your previous run will be touched upon by you this year.
I understand the reasoning behind this but I just can't let go of the fact that the Maestro may be alive and well in the present time now and this will not be resolved.
Ok, I'd love to see another Pantheon story, no way is their former leader dead!
Any idea when your new Marvel series will be revealed?
Thanks for a fun Hulk issue.
I enjoyed this issue for several reasons.
No drawn out plot lines or pages of dialogue only
with no action
The Hulk makes an appearance in his own book
Hulk Smashing (shark and squid)
Lee Weeks art
Monsters!!!!
The hope that we are seeing a Peter David run on the Hulk that will last for a while.
I enjoyed the Joe Casey run and liked some elements of Jones and Jenkins but overall felt disappointed with both.While I try to not Byrne bash too much his arc started of good then went to a whole Hulk Body /mind swap with Tyrannus thing that was soooo lame!!!!
Welcome back Peter and here is to a long run.
Any Cowboy Pete soon???
From the previews,Point Pleasant looks good (Dina meyer Yeah!!!),House M.d is great ,and am interested in your opinions on Lost and Alias
TTFN
I loved it PAD. Its good to have you back. I enjoyed the water breathing sci-fi element you added, I'm always impressed when this little creative twist is added to a story. The art was fabulous and I'm eager to get the next issue.
Best wishes and I look forward to supporting your Hulk run.
Well, I heard the script at Dragoncon, so I wasn't confused at all by the shark. :) You know when you hear a script, and you form the visuals in your head, and then the real thing doesn't come up to your imagination?
This was a rare exception.
For the record, I have no problem with the pacing at all. With the advent of the Hulk through the water, it felt like a beginning of something, the restarting of the franchise almost as the rebirth/reinvention of the Hulk. I know it's part of a five-issue arc, so I don't expect anything to be resolved by the end of issue one.
The art was great. Did I mention that yet? As much as I've been frothing at the mouth over boring art in some books and downright bizarre in others, it was wonderful to see the work that can be done with the space to do it.
Looking forward to the rest - and answers to more questions.
This is the first Hulk comic I ever read. I've been a fan of your work since I "discovered" you a couple of years ago. I picked up Hulk 77 to see if it would be good.
Nice work! I'll be around for 78
-Adam
Ps. Been reading Fallen Angel since the beginning. Great read!